SOMMS Digest - 11 May 1998 to 12 May 1998
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There are 28 messages totalling 1229 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. uni-dimensional? (2)
  2. Lyrics and Music: Cornell.
  3. The Breakup
  4. SOMMSfests?
  5. Not about the breakup! (fwd)
  6. Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest (6)
  7. SOMMSfest
  8. SOMMSfest clarifications
  9. the matt chat
 10. SOMMSfest 98 not a very good idea... (2)
 11. SOMMSfest Clarifications/Flaming
 12. Sommsfest 98
 13. Fwd: Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest
 14. just a thought...
 15. AUGH!!!! SOMMSfest-fiasco!!!
 16. Tighter and Tighter
 17. last and final sommsfest post (i hope!)
 18. one big happy family
 19. (fwd) Renewal of your subscription to the SOMMS list
 20. zeh dotu thingy single mabob
 21. What i saw about the whole Seattle gathering thing

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with the following in the body of your message:

			    SIGNOFF SOMMS

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 02:21:07 -0500
From:    Bill Flanders <whflanders@MAIL.UTEXAS.EDU>
Subject: Re: uni-dimensional?

>>Zero Chance.  It should have been the first.  It really would have
>>changed the uni-dimensional impression the final singles gave to the
>>public.
>
>  i don't know if they'd have released another single off of DOTU, but if
>they had, my bet would have to be on Rhinosaur. it was being primed and
>fed to the public in pieces by mass radio anyways. that's how BHS got
>released...

Or maybe Dusty, which I didn't really appreciate until I heard the remix.

>  BUTT... hmmm.... i don't know about that DOTU singles being
>uni-dimensional thing. Pretty Noose vs. blow up the outside world? pretty
>bi-polar. then throw in Burden and you've got a third dimension. the punk
>asshole-ness of Ty Cobb adds the 4th dimension and Bleed Together kinda
>sits somewhere between Burden, Blow Up, and Ty Cobb while not exactly
>resembling any of them. i found the last album to be pretty much as
>multi-faceted as Superunknown, just with a totally different feel.  You
>want to talk about straight-on one-dimensional singles, you'd have to
>look at BMF's singles: Rusty Cage, Outshined, Jesus Christ Pose... that's
>head-on collisions with no end in sight. SU changed that, and DOTU proved
>they could still keep up the multi-dimensional deal if they felt like it.
>I'd have liked to have seen something as far out as Overfloater hit the
>airways, just to throw people a bit. Applebite would have been fun to
>listen to nerdy kids complain about and Matt Pinfield drool over. ;-)
>
> mind riot

Yeah,  I guess that was the wrong way to put it...  Rolling Stone, our favorite
critic tribe, termed DOTU as simply "rocking out."  And yeah, there is some bipo
laredness... but it all leads non-fans to one conclusion - Soundgarden can try t
o write a good melody, but when the shit hits the fan they have to resort to pur
e volume and intensity to entertain people, which is an unfair take on the band.
   So yeah... I wish along the years they had released some of the calmer songs.
.. if only so I wouldn't have to endure. "Oh, you like Soundgarden?  SPOOOOOONM
AN!" (falsetto chicken impression).

<virtual handshake to Niki, glad we're back on the same team>

Bill

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 19:21:54 +0900
From:    fluttergirl <coatesr@TAUNET.NET.AU>
Subject: Re: uni-dimensional?

I always thought the next single would be (and should've been, in my view)
Tighter & Tighter. It has that deep, thick epic thing about it. And that solo!!
Probably my favourite song on the album.

Has anyone heard this Tighter & Tighter played live? (I'm not sure whether
this has or has not been touched on.)

Lily.

--------------------------------------
'...One last sin before I'm dead...'
--------------------------------------
Terribly Terribly...
                        Lillith Evans

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 12:28:36 +0100
From:    Guillaume PETETIN <p6mip100@CICRP.JUSSIEU.FR>
Subject: Lyrics and Music: Cornell.

> There was a discussion not too long ago in this list about whether Chris
> and Kim could be compared as guitar players.
>
> Almost everybody agreed that Kim is a better soloist. However someone said
> that Kim probably was the author of most riffs included in the first albums
> (until Badmotorfinger).
>
> Moreover, only Kim plays guitar in "Outshined" and "Room A Thousand Years
> Wide" in Motorvision. So my question is: why is Chris the one who signs for
> the music in those songs?

Well, easy one : because he wrote them.

>
> Does it mean that Kim just limited to play on stage? Or maybe Chris ordered
> Kim the notes to play during the process of composition?

Let's compare a rock band and an orchestra. Even though Beethoven wrote
all of his symphonies all alone, he did not play a single instrument
on it (maybe he conducted some shows??). A band works the same : the one
who composes most of the song is the composer. Then , depending on the band
it is reworked and interpreted. Some band say that as the whole band work
so much on the songs, it is impossible to distinguish and the credits
and publishing are for the band as a whole. Let's say CC is SG's Sting...

Don't hesitate if you have any more questions, "stupid" or not :)

PIF

>
> Can anybody tell me something about it?
>
> Pablo
>

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 12:37:45 +0100
From:    Guillaume PETETIN <p6mip100@CICRP.JUSSIEU.FR>
Subject: Re: The Breakup

>           However, I do have my own speculations reguarding the band's
> breakup.  Don't take them as facts, but at pure, meaningless theory (you may
> want to grab a pen and paper):
>            1)  SG felt old after the Smashing Pumpkins took their award at the
> Grammy Awards.  Pretty Noose, Again, and Tripping on a Hole in a Paper Heart
> all lost to some shitty song!  It wasn't the first time SG lost an award, but
> it sure as hell was a blow.  Young Corgan (-SP) won over 'dusty' soundgarden.
> With the music industry beginning to sag and a feeling of obsoleteness,
> Soundgarden called it quits.
>             2) Sales of DOTU (highly unlikely because record sales meant
> nothing to the band before)
>             3) The band felt that after DOTU, there wasn't anything elso to
> do- Screaming Life&FOPP (beginning), UMOK (experimentation), LTL (don't get
> pissed if I say that it was "mainstream"(or at least the most mainstream of
> the SG albums)), BMF (metal), Superunknown (new style of experimentation), and
> DOTU (mellow cool music).  What next; country music?
>              4) Retire at pique
>              5) Desire for new projects (What about Wellwater, and TOTD
> though?)
>              6) A band member wanted out to swim in money (we don't like to
> think about it, but it's possible)
>              7) NO MORE TOURING!
>              8) Lack of appreciation and respect from the larger music
> audiance (MTV sucks cock)
>              9) "Bands make music"- Cornell.  Maybe someone just didn't want
> to jump right back into the loop.  The disagreement split the band.  They had
> 13 years together and thought it perfectly natural to disband.
>             10) Write your theses here- my hands hurt
IMHO, the only culprit we can blame is the band itself.

PIF

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 12:44:33 +0100
From:    Guillaume PETETIN <p6mip100@CICRP.JUSSIEU.FR>
Subject: SOMMSfests?

> Ummmm, I think I speak for some other SOMMSters in saying it wouldn't be too
> fair if they got to hang with Matt, and those of us going to other shows
> didn't.  I mean I think it's cool that you would get to do it and stuff, but I
> don't know, put in a good word for us other SOMMSters going to non-Seattle
> shows (i.e. Sacramento.)
> And I also don't want to be extorting PJ or Matt, but if other fans get to
> just 'cause they're on this list, why shouldn't we all?
>
> Matt
>
> P.S. Please don't flame me or anything, I'm just raising a question that I,
> and I'm sure others had on their mind.

I just think some people are truly persuaded that, living in the Right area
or going to see THE show at THE place, they are THE ON TRUE THING (fans
in this situation). If they can't realize some people living as far as
Sacramento can actually go to see PJ and like them! And having heard of
SG as well! You're kidding, right? aren't you in Seattle??

Hey there are even human living outside the US :) !

PIF - I'm in JCP waiting for the nails and flames

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 12:49:50 +0100
From:    Guillaume PETETIN <p6mip100@CICRP.JUSSIEU.FR>
Subject: Not about the breakup! (fwd)

> Hey everyone
>
> Where the hell can I find Angel on Fire,Black Cat, Unholy War, and Stolen
> Prayers?  I only know that they exist because of the lyric list on the
> Unofficial SG page.
>
> thanx
> Chris
>
Stolen prayers and Unholy War are on the Alice Cooper's Last temptation??
Well, the one on which the artwork is from the one and only Dave McKean.
Maybe Unholy War coulde be a good song, but pleaase, Alice, shut up!

PIF

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 08:34:27 EDT
From:    O6z6z6y <O6z6z6y@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest

In a message dated 98-05-10 23:44:45 EDT, you write:

<< this whole plan just doesn't make any
 sense.

 cordially,

 --caryn rose
 co-webmaster, five horizons
 (and former sommster) >>


Why wouldn't it make any sense for lovers of music (I'm sure 95% of the peeps
willing to hook this up dig both bands) to meet & embrace the entity that is
music?  IMHO this seems like a really close-minded response to a resonable
invitation.

<<if we were going to support such a thing, it would be with one of the pj
mailing lists, and while we think it is majorly cool that fans organize
gatherings and meet each other, we are really shy people and like meeting
other fans one on one, at shows, waiting on line.  so 'sponsoring' a
gathering, especially a sg-oriented one, not a pj-oriented one, isn't
anything we feel comfortable doing.  if we were going to do such a thing
(which we aren't, and have discussed this topic ad nauseum on pearl jam
lists for the last *five years*), we would do it for the pearl jam fans
that have been visiting our web site for the last two and a half years.>>

Seems to me that someone's trying to keep the PJ community pure.  This whole
letter just reeks of arrogance IMHO.  If I'm reading it wrong please correct
me, but that's the way it smells to me.

L8r

~^v^OzzY^v^~

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 09:32:06 -0400
From:    Seth Perlman <saperl@INJERSEY.COM>
Subject: Re: Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest

As Caryn mentioned in her email, we talked about this yesterday and are in
agreement: people getting together and meeting at the Pearl Jam shows is a
great idea, but neither of us feels it's appropriate to plan to meet the
band based on the fact that we're members of this list. That time has come
and gone. The Chicago event was a once in a lifetime thing that happened
because the following things were all true:

1. Silver Management is extremely conscious of Net activities. They receive
the digest, so they were fully aware of the circumstances surrounding the
gathering (see #2 below). Silver Management has nothing to do with the PJ
tour, and Curtis Management doesn't display the same level of involvement in
mailing lists, websites, etc.

2. The gathering was going to happen anyway, regardless of meeting the band.
This is the most important thing - the plans were laid a long time before
Kathie received word from Silver Mgmt that anyone going to the shows would
be able to meet the band.

3. It was the first time such an activity had been proposed. Subsequent
requests for special treatment will come across as obnoxious.

4. A Silver Management representative was available to fly out to Chicago
and coordinate the whole thing. Remember, this is not like giving one person
a backstage pass - she had to deal with 20 people in addition to whatever
was already scheduled for the band on both nights.

If you're interested in trying to gather up support for a PJ meet-n-greet,
you should try to do so on a PJ mailing list. Good luck.

-seth
listadmin

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 07:22:29 PDT
From:    Arden SunGod <ardensungod@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: SOMMSfest

I'm not sure when the whole SOMMSfest Seattle thing came to be about
meeting the band, as far as I took it, the whole band thing was an
afterthought of Nick's, like "oh hey, that'd be cool."  Am I misled into
thinking that just because we're not going to meet the band, we're not
getting together?  I thought the show was just a really good excuse to
get a bunch of sommsters in one place.  Correct me, I seem to be wrong.

-Arden

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 10:18:54 -0700
From:    Caryn Rose <clr@DRIZZLE.COM>
Subject: Re: Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest

On Mon, 11 May 1998, O6z6z6y wrote:

> Why wouldn't it make any sense for lovers of music (I'm sure 95% of the peeps
> willing to hook this up dig both bands) to meet & embrace the entity that is
> music?  IMHO this seems like a really close-minded response to a resonable
> invitation.

If you read my message again, you will see that I said (very clearly) that
we think it is *great* when fans of ANY band want to meet up.  However, it
is not anything that our web page wants to be involved in.  period.
We are not even organizing gatherings for Pearl Jam fans, so why on earth
would we organize one for Soundgarden fans?

> Seems to me that someone's trying to keep the PJ community pure.  This whole
> letter just reeks of arrogance IMHO.  If I'm reading it wrong please correct
> me, but that's the way it smells to me.

read above.  The way the cosmos worked out, I'm a soundgarden fan, I used
to be on SOMMS, Seth and I are friends, and I run a pearl jam web page.
If i was just Joe Random Pearl Jam webmaster, I would tell you to get
lost.

Please explain to me why a web page, about Pearl Jam, that you do not run,
has to do what you want them to do?  Seth has *never* promoted SOMMSfests
on his web page, so why do I have to do so on mine?

I don't understand WHY my web page has to be involved in a SOMMS gathering
whatsoever.  Perhaps someone could explain?

--caryn

[don't worry, I won't be on this list for long, but I knew we'd get flamed
for this.]

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 3 May 1998 01:23:26 -0400
From:    "Michelle A. Leco" <webproducer@PETERSTWP.COM>
Subject: SOMMSfest clarifications

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It seems to me that the lines of communication are getting crossed in all of
these e-mail/flames.

As one of the people who will be going to the Seattle PJ show, let me make
my points clear:

1.  I would be going to the show even if I did not meet any other SOMMSters
at the show.  I want to see Pearl Jam.  I think that it will be great to see
them in their home town with their home town audience.

2.  I do not think that I am a *better* fan just because I'm flying out to
Seattle for the show.  Maybe luckier, but not better.  (What the fuck is all
of this true fan shit anyway?)

3.  From communicating with other SOMMS people going to the show, I never
had the impression that we were meeting with the intention of meeting the
band.  As I recall it, it started with people posting to the list just happy
that they nabbed tickets, (as I did).  Then there was the "Hey, why not  get
together."  This is when I started compiling a list of e-mails of people
going to the show.  I did this with the intent of us being able to write
back and forth w/o having to bug the rest of the list with our mundane
details.  (Like can everyone meet at such and such place at such and such
time.  Or hey, I found a good place to stay.  Or anyone want to get together
to go to such and such bar?)

4.  While the idea of meeting any band members, be it from PJ or SG, sounded
way cool, I had always viewed it as unlikely.  So hey, if it happened,
great!  If not, I'm still going to see an amazing show put on by an amazing
band.  AND I'm going to meet some people who feel the same as I do.

5.  And lastly, I don't think that the original letter to 5H was asking the
site to promote the gathering.  A quote from the letter states that "We were
wondering if 5H would also like to participate in any way that you wanted,
and make it like a joint event."  I had interpreted this as meaning we
SOMMSters are SG fans AND PJ fans.  All of you are PJ fans, so we're
assuming you're SG fans as well.  Why not get together and we can meet *each
other*.  As in we're meeting each other and you're invited to our little get
together.  No where in the original letter did it request that 5H help or
organize, be a go-between, or pull some strings.  Refer back to the quote,
"participate in any way that you wanted."  So if 5H wants to meet with us,
cool, the more the merrier.  If not, that's ok too!

But really the point is that the PJ concert is going to be a fun event!  Why
turn a fun event into bitter memories by being jealous that you're not going
to the concert, or viewing those who are going with disdain, or by arguing
with members of other 'fan groups'!  Working to get together to meet is
worth the effort, arguing is not.  So let's drop it!

~Michelle


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<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>It seems to me that the lines of =
communication are=20
getting crossed in all of these e-mail/flames.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>As one of the people who will be going to the =
Seattle=20
PJ show, let me make my points clear:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>1.&nbsp; I would be going to the show even if =
I did not=20
meet any other SOMMSters at the show.&nbsp; I want to see Pearl =
Jam.&nbsp; I=20
think that it will be great to see them in their home town with their =
home town=20
audience.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>2.&nbsp; I do not think that I am a *better* =
fan just=20
because I'm flying out to Seattle for the show.&nbsp; Maybe luckier, but =
not=20
better.&nbsp; (What the fuck is all of this true fan shit =
anyway?)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>3.&nbsp; From communicating with other SOMMS =
people=20
going to the show, I never had the impression that we were meeting with =
the=20
intention of meeting the band.&nbsp; As I recall it, it started with =
people=20
posting to the list just happy that they nabbed tickets, (as I =
did).&nbsp; Then=20
there was the &quot;Hey, why not&nbsp; get together.&quot;&nbsp; This is =
when I=20
started compiling a list of e-mails of people going to the show.&nbsp; I =
did=20
this with the intent of us being able to write back and forth w/o having =
to bug=20
the rest of the list with our mundane details.&nbsp; (Like can everyone =
meet at=20
such and such place at such and such time.&nbsp; Or hey, I found a good =
place to=20
stay.&nbsp; Or anyone want to get together to go to such and such=20
bar?)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>4.&nbsp; While the idea of meeting any band =
members, be=20
it from PJ or SG, sounded way cool, I had always viewed it as =
unlikely.&nbsp; So=20
hey, if it happened, great!&nbsp; If not, I'm still going to see an =
amazing show=20
put on by an amazing band.&nbsp; AND I'm going to meet some people who =
feel the=20
same as I do.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>5.&nbsp; And lastly, I don't think that the =
original=20
letter to 5H was asking the site to promote the gathering.&nbsp; A quote =
from=20
the letter states that &quot;We were wondering if 5H would also like to=20
participate in any way that you wanted, and make it like a joint=20
event.&quot;&nbsp; I had interpreted this as meaning we SOMMSters are SG =
fans=20
AND PJ fans.&nbsp; All of you are PJ fans, so we're assuming you're SG =
fans as=20
well.&nbsp; Why not get together and we can meet *each other*.&nbsp; As =
in we're=20
meeting each other and you're invited to our little get together.&nbsp; =
No where=20
in the original letter did it request that 5H help or organize, be a =
go-between,=20
or pull some strings.&nbsp; Refer back to the quote, &quot;participate =
in any=20
way that you wanted.&quot;&nbsp; So if 5H wants to meet with us, cool, =
the more=20
the merrier.&nbsp; If not, that's ok too!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>But really the point is that the PJ concert =
is going to=20
be a fun event!&nbsp; Why turn a fun event into bitter memories by being =
jealous=20
that you're not going to the concert, or viewing those who are going =
with=20
disdain, or by arguing with members of other 'fan groups'!&nbsp; Working =
to get=20
together to meet is worth the effort, arguing is not.&nbsp; So let's =
drop=20
it!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>~Michelle<BR></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 17:46:59 EDT
From:    niki freer <limo_wreck@JUNO.COM>
Subject: the matt chat

ya know, i finally got through that thing and found some neato stuff in
there. good questions you guys, he seemed to be having a blast! the poor
person who had to try and type up all his responses as fast as those
questions come...ugh. i would not do that. = )
 anyways, my favorite thing from the whole chat transcript would have to
be this:


skulmstr - Is there ever a chance that Soundgarden will play together
again?
Matt Cameron - skulmstr...Never say never.


ah, thank goodness! also, the "we were sick of each other" is all i'll
ever need as reason for breaking up. it's just like a romantic
relationship. you get sick of the person, you break up with them. love ya
matt, hope you can get into the site sometime soon, i'd love to hear from
ya.

 mind riot

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------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 17:01:16 -0500
From:    Gary Rees <GARYREES@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
Subject: SOMMSfest 98 not a very good idea...

I don't think this whole SOMMS fest idea would work out because remember
it's a PEARL JAM show not a SOundgarden one.  Also, do you really think
that the other members of Soundgarden are gonna show up after they  broke
up? rememver, people, Soundgarden isn't togehter anymore.

Just wanted to state my opinion...

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 18:24:44 EDT
From:    SubPop77 <SubPop77@AOL.COM>
Subject: SOMMSfest Clarifications/Flaming

SOMMS,

First of all I would like to request NO MORE FLAMING of the 5H people...they
are nice and perfectly rational people that are entitled to their viewpoint.

Second...let me clarify myself. My idea of SOMMSfest is PJ and SG fans meeting
and having fun, hanging out.  The idea that we would meet the band is not very
likely (slim to none) and was an idea someone (no idea who) posted to SOMMS.
Thinking it would be cool I included it in my letter, and they thought that it
was the main reason. People get confused..no big deal. Even if the people at
5H dont want anything to do with it...so what...its a SOMMSfest...since they
really have nothing to do with SOMMS, then why would they go..I just thought
it would be a good idea, and nice to see if they wanted to hang out too. Who
knows...maybe we can work things out...and maybe not...either way we will all
have a kick ass time seeing a totally rockin band.

-Nick

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 18:34:00 -0400
From:    El Conspiraco <cosh@GOLDEN.NET>
Subject: Re: SOMMSfest 98 not a very good idea...

I don't think this whole SOMMS fest idea would work out because remember
it's a PEARL JAM show not a SOundgarden one.  Also, do you really think
that the other members of Soundgarden are gonna show up after they  broke
up? rememver, people, Soundgarden isn't togehter anymore.

Just wanted to state my opinion...

[]  Sorry to bring something nasty up but the guys still love each other and
Ben & Matt as well as Chris & Matt are still working together....so there is a
VERY strong chance they'll get together...if not for a drink afterwards..

Dave

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 16:07:38 PDT
From:    Star Pancake <miss_mafoo@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Sommsfest 98

>>I don't think this whole SOMMS fest idea would work out because
remember it's a PEARL JAM show not a SOundgarden one.>> Yeah, and your
point would be....what? So because I like Pearl Jam and there are other
people who like Pearl Jam on this list, we should just not even bother
to try to find the others? I was thinking as the two events as seperate
things. A Pearl Jam concert just seemed to be the most convienient place
(Plus SOUNDGARDEN'S drummer is performing). I never even began to think
of asking to meet PJ, so don't try to ruin it for the rest of us.
>>Also, do you really think that the other members of Soundgarden are
gonna show up after they  broke up?>> Well, what do you think, that they
all live in cages now that they broke up?? They still have lives,
y'know...plus Chris is best buds with Eddie, so, it's a conceivable
happening.
>>rememver, people, Soundgarden isn't togehter anymore.>> Thanks for
reminding me. Really, I think I forgot. <as my voice drips with sarcasm>

>>Just wanted to state my opinion...>> Thanks for sharing. It's still
on, though.>>

As for caryn rose's message to Nick, the point of the original idea
wasn't to meet the band. Sure, it'd be cool, but it wasn't our first
intent. We wanted to meet some of our friends that we've never had the
chance to meet before, and, with Matt Cameron behind the skins, PJ
seemed like the most fitting place to do it at. Besides, unlike rap,
there is no rift between bands. It is not a crime to be a fan of
Soundgarden AND Pearl Jam at the same time. =\
This whole thread is really disappointing, as was the "Kim breaking the
band up" one. I don't know what the hell is wrong with some people, but
this started out to be an innocent, get together between friends at a
concert by a band I love and respect.

No hard feelings, but I'm pretty pissed off.

~pUnKy



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------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 12 May 1998 09:07:30 +1000
From:    Koggle <gikk@LOGICWORLD.COM.AU>
Subject: Re: Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest

Hey Sommsters..

I agree that the idea of a SOMMSfest at a Pearl Jam concert makes no sense..
but let's clarify that.. What is a SOMMSfest?

1* A group of SOMMS members meeting up at a certain place
2* A group of SOMMSters meeting up with the hopes of recreating the Chicago
meeting.

The #1? sure.. why not? there was even a mini-SOMMSfest at a Radiohead show in
Brisbane :) (right Justin?) But like a couple people have said, Chicago was a on
e
time thing and alot of effort went into it.. the band is not together anymore,
understand that they're not going to be planning or doing any promotional type
things (such as meeting fans) at all.... nothing like they've done previously..
besides.. at a *Pearl Jam* concert?! if they are there at all, they will most
probably be there for personal and leisurely reasons (if that makes sense).. i
really doubt they would do a 'band thing' together, just because they are pretty
tight with another band that's playing..

It may not seem 'fair' to some that the SOMMSters in Chicago at the time got to
meet them, but so what.. life isn't fair.. not everyone on the list is going to
get to have that experience.. it was just luck.. i don't think "it just won't be
fair" will hold up with any other types of requests made to any other websites o
r
managements..

Something i'm stuck on... why does 5 horizons have to be involved? like.. sure
you like the website, but like.. why meet them??  From what i have seen, the
motivation behind alot of people's decision to go to the Seattle show/s was in
the hopes that *someone* from Soundgarden would be there.. and maybe if you got
buddy-buddy with 5 horizons people, you'd get into some backstage sort of thing
and get special treatment because you're on the net too (or something) and you
like Pearl Jam and their hometown friends.. but that's just a guess.. correct me
if i'm wrong..

why don't you guys just go to the show.. enjoy it... spend quality sommster time
together.. and be glad that Pearl Jam is still together.. :)

Koggle

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 19:24:04 -0400
From:    "Mr.Product!" <bib@LSDS.COM>
Subject: Re: Fwd: Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest

>Content-ID: <0_894858247@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1>
>Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>
>This is the response i got...sucks huh....maybe we can sort things out because
>the main purpose is not to meet the band...ill keep trying
>
>Return-Path: <target@fivehorizons.com>
>Received: from  rly-zc03.mx.aol.com (rly-zc03.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.3]) by
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>Received: from drizzle.com (slug.drizzle.com [207.207.67.200])
>          by rly-zc03.mx.aol.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0)
>          with ESMTP id WAA16792 for <SubPop77@aol.com>;
>          Sun, 10 May 1998 22:44:56 -0400 (EDT)
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>        SMTP id TAA10778; Sun, 10 May 1998 19:45:44 -0700
>Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 19:45:43 -0700 (PDT)
>From: Five Horizons <target@fivehorizons.com>
>Sender: target@drizzle.com
>Reply-To: target@fivehorizons.com
>To: SubPop77 <SubPop77@aol.com>
>cc: saperl@injersey.com
>Subject: Re: Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest
>In-Reply-To: <6c7d6e17.3556255c@aol.com>
>Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.96.980510152915.31588B-100000@drizzle.com>
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
>
>
>hi there.
>
>i (caryn) was a long-time member of SOMMS.  i almost went to chicago, and
>i'm totally aware of all the circumstances surrounding the chicago
>sommsfest.
>
>the difference between what you are proposing, and what happened in
>chicago, was the fact that the impetus for chicago was *NOT* to meet the
>band.  everyone just decided to go to the chicago shows, since they were
>on weekends, were fairly central to many people.  it was a chance for a
>lot of people who were friends, but had never met, to meet up, so even
>more people decided to go, bought their tickets, got plane tickets.
>
>*after* it was all set up and everyone was already going, someone in the
>group said, ya know, we're all gonna be there, let me write and see if
>there's any way to meet the band.  and that was the reason that silver
>management was open to the request, because it wasn't "let's see if we can
>meet the band and we'll all go to that show", it was we're friends, let's
>try and meet each other.  people were going to chicago for that reason,
>and not to meet the band.  and they got to go backstage and meet the band
>before the show - the band didn't show up at any kind of event.
>
>The Chicago SOMMSfest was a once-in-a-lifetime event that happened because
>it was members of an SG mailing list dealing with SG's management about an
>SG concert. Now that SG doesn't exist, it kind of seems inappropriate for
>SOMMS, as members of an SG list, to expect, request or even mention
>special treatment (not that it ever was in the first place) at a *Pearl
>Jam* event. Silver Management has nothing to do with this tour and
>it would be bad form to use SOMMS membership as some kind of "reason" why
>there should be anything remotely close to the Chicago gathering. Curtis
>Management (pj's management) does not view pj mailing lists (which, again,
>SOMMS is not) or pj 'internet fans' or web sites with the same light that
>Silver Management did.  for example, five horizons has no contact with
>curtis management, nor do we want any.  we most definitely do not want to
>be in the position of intermediaries requesting official 'recognition' of
>a request we ourselves don't agree with.  and again, you're a
>*soundgarden* list!
>
>if we were going to support such a thing, it would be with one of the pj
>mailing lists, and while we think it is majorly cool that fans organize
>gatherings and meet each other, we are really shy people and like meeting
>other fans one on one, at shows, waiting on line.  so 'sponsoring' a
>gathering, especially a sg-oriented one, not a pj-oriented one, isn't
>anything we feel comfortable doing.  if we were going to do such a thing
>(which we aren't, and have discussed this topic ad nauseum on pearl jam
>lists for the last *five years*), we would do it for the pearl jam fans
>that have been visiting our web site for the last two and a half years.
>
>the fact remains, however, the curtis management will say "no", if not
>ignore your request completely.  if they haven't been willing ot
>accomodate pj mailing lists, why would they do so for a soundgarden list?
>
>i know this wasn't the response you wanted; i am cc'ing seth since we've
>discussed it today in email (and since you already sent a copy of this to
>the list, so i'm assuming you're going to forward any response i give you
>to the list).  i am also going to subscribe to SOMMS so i am present to
>address any discussion or flames that will undoubtedly arise as a result
>of our refusal to facilitate this plan.
>
>this has nothing to do with not liking soundgarden, not liking matt
>cameron, or any such nonsense; we've already taken a *considerable* amount
>of flak from the pj community for our whole-hearted embrace of matt
>cameron to the pj drum stool.  this whole plan just doesn't make any
>sense.
>
>cordially,
>
>--caryn rose
>co-webmaster, five horizons
>(and former sommster)
>
wow.im sorry, but that has GOT to be one of the most obnoxious letters  ive
ever seen.what assholes.
and im too far away to even go to the show.heh
bib

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 19:31:34 EDT
From:    O6z6z6y <O6z6z6y@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest

In a message dated 98-05-11 13:31:51 EDT, you write:

<<
 > Why wouldn't it make any sense for lovers of music (I'm sure 95% of the
peeps
 > willing to hook this up dig both bands) to meet & embrace the entity that
is
 > music?  IMHO this seems like a really close-minded response to a resonable
 > invitation.

 If you read my message again, you will see that I said (very clearly) that
 we think it is *great* when fans of ANY band want to meet up.  However, it
 is not anything that our web page wants to be involved in.  period.
 We are not even organizing gatherings for Pearl Jam fans, so why on earth
 would we organize one for Soundgarden fans?>>

So do explain how you can feel an idea is great & not want to participate in
it?  Your beliefs must not be very strong or run very deep...to me you sound
no different than a politician.  Why would one endorse something one is not
willing to do?

 > Seems to me that someone's trying to keep the PJ community pure.  This
whole
 > letter just reeks of arrogance IMHO.  If I'm reading it wrong please
correct
 > me, but that's the way it smells to me.


 Please explain to me why a web page, about Pearl Jam, that you do not run,
 has to do what you want them to do?  Seth has *never* promoted SOMMSfests
 on his web page, so why do I have to do so on mine?

 I don't understand WHY my web page has to be involved in a SOMMS gathering
 whatsoever.  Perhaps someone could explain?

 --caryn

 [don't worry, I won't be on this list for long, but I knew we'd get flamed
 for this.]
  >>

It was a fucking invitation...do you know what that means???  Nobody ever said
you HAD to do jack squat.  If you feel an invitation is a twisting of your arm
or an obligation for you to coordinate anything with your web followers you
are sorely mistaken and very weak.  Personally, from the way you seem so moody
about a fucking INVITATION (which BTW can be politely declined) & your lack of
tact, I wouldn't give 2 shits about meeting up with you at any event.
Evidently (note to however e-mailed you to begin with) you were the absolutely
wrong individual to contact regarding any friendly extensions of unity or
meeting.

L8r

~^v^OzzY^v^~

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 16:39:19 PDT
From:    Arden SunGod <ardensungod@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Pearl Jam Seattle 98/SOMMSfest

SOMMS-

Let me at least attempt to clarify this.. everyone else's trys seem to
have been in vain, but it cant hurt too much.

SEATTLE SOMMSfest '98-

The point of this little get together is to have the sommsters attending
the show to meet up.  In my humble opinion, a sommsfest is any group of
sommsters who get together for the specific point of getting together
with your fellow list members.  Pearl Jam just happens to be a
convenient place to have it.  Hell, if we wanted to we could throw a
Yanni SOMMSfest, alright??

Secondly, I dont see why the whole list is in a tizzy about this,
Seattle SOMMSfest is happening weather you guys complain about it or
not.  If it bothers everyone *that* much we could call it "A Bunch of
Seattle Soundgarden Fans Get Together at a Pearl Jam Concert Because
They Feel Like It."  If calling it a SOMMSfest offends people, or offers
up the idea that it's supposed to replicate the Chicago SOMMSfest,
apologies.

So like I said, calm down, people!  We're going to have it no matter
what happens on the list, and we're going to have fun doing it.  The
only way Pearl Jam comes into this matter at all, is because that's
where we're meeting.  Hey, if we meet before or after the show, even
non-Pearl Jam sommsters could come.  No need to get all stressed about
it!

-Arden

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------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 20:03:11 EDT
From:    B Ganoush <BGanoush@AOL.COM>
Subject: just a thought...

Soundgarden breaking up reminds me a bit of Seinfeld ending.  They both
decided to quit at their peaks, so as to not just fizzle out a few years down
the road leaving  everyone thinking "What the hell happened to the good old
days when they kicked so much ass?"
Don't get me wrong--I know we'd all love to hear more from the coolest fucking
band in the existence of mankind-- who knows if they had even hit their peak
yet?  I have yet to hear a bad song by them.

Chris

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 20:45:46 EDT
From:    niki freer <limo_wreck@JUNO.COM>
Subject: AUGH!!!! SOMMSfest-fiasco!!!

Jesus!!

 Since when did SOMMSfest 98 become such a big fucking deal? when it was
all proposed, no one seemed to care the least. it's only since Nick
contacted some PJ people (for what reason, i'm not really sure. that's
not to say it was a bad idea, after all it is a PJ concert and Caryn was
a sommster at one time) and Caryn's response was posted that everyone
seems to have gotten bugs up their collective asses. Get over it people!
by hell- it's just a concert. I'm jealous as hell that i can't be there,
but not cause someone said something (innocently or not) about meeting
PJ. Because i like PJ, i like Matt, and i love the fact that there's that
Cornell opening rumor running round the mill. It's all so damn exciting!
PJ in their hometown with Matt on the kit and a possiblity of some ToTD
or even a CC solo performance!! Who would't want to be there?!!
 But that's not what the SOMMSfests are about, or not what i believe them
to be about. They're about meeting the people we sit here and blindly
write all of our deep inner thoughts about SG with every day. It's about
putting faces to the computer names we see weekly. It's about making some
really cool friends and having the experience ofa lifetime maybe! it's
about having some goddamn good fun with some fellow fans!
 And those of you bitching how 'why have it at a PJ show' well- get this
Soundgarden ain't a band anymore. This is the closest it's ever going to
come to a SG show. You've got Matt on drums and everyone else lurking
around sneakily. Something wonderful could happen, or it could just be
any old PJ show in Seattle. But this is the closest we'll come to seeing
SG live again. Matt on the drums in a legend of a Seattle band.
 So now i'm babbling. But what i'm trying to say is fucking STOP arguing
about it. Please do it OFF the list if you're too jealous to just deal
with it. Don't flame back and forth about the note from 5H. No, Nick
didn't ask for any sponsorship or that kind of thing and the note was a
bit off-center but who gives a fuck? They don't want to come along, fuck
'em! It's a SOMMSfest anyways. (NOTE for Caryn: last comment was not
meant in a detrimental way.)

Have fun in Seattle, fellow SOMMSters, and I hope something kick ass
happens out there for ya! Go shoot some pool with Ben and get drunk at
the OK Hotel! Check out some other bands while your around, if you're
staying for more than the show. But jeez, don't everyone else get all
angry cause you can't go too.

 mind riot

_____________________________________________________________________
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Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 21:52:31 EDT
From:    Jeffi29 <Jeffi29@AOL.COM>
Subject: Tighter and Tighter

     Tighter and Tighter is probably my favorite song on DOTU besides Boot
Camp.  It has everything that was "trademark" to soundgarden...The signature
Chris Cornell voice...the deep, powerful, yet not too heavy lyrics...Matt
doing his usual kick-ass job behind the tubs...and of course Kim shredding,
like he always has, and always should be.
     T&T is just an all around great sound and representation of the
band...and I'm probably all boring you to death, considering that this sounds
like a newspaper article, so...I'll stop.

~Jeff~

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 19:13:29 -0700
From:    caryn rose <clr@DRIZZLE.COM>
Subject: last and final sommsfest post (i hope!)

first of all... i didn't start this.  it got thrown on us.  and i'm one of
the two people who run the web site, i am the one who is "public", and this
is a joint decision.

two, i didn't say "don't have a gathering," i said, "it's great that fans
want to meet but it's not anything we want to be involved in."  period.
what the hell this has to do with 'convictions' i sure as hell don't know.
i can think someone's idea is a good one but it might not be right for
*me*.  that's called being mature and being able to recognize that while
you're not interested in something, it might interest other folks.

three, there are lots of pearl jam fan parties this summer, and while we've
been invited and asked to promote these gatherings on our site, we're not
doing it for a lot of reasons, first and foremost because we have our hands
full right now just keeping up with what the *band* is doing, let alone the
zillions of pearl jam fans on the net.  if we're not going to do this for
our community, we're not going to do it for another community.

four, we have NO connection with the band, and we'll be in the audience at
those two seattle shows like the rest of you.  i wouldn't have been one of
the last 10 people let into the surprise pj small club show last thursday
(their first with matt!) if i had any connection to the band. =)

i guess i'm fucked no matter what, because unless i responded with, "yes,
this is a super idea, we will do whatever you want us to do" i'd get flamed.

--caryn

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 20:13:51 PDT
From:    rachel reisman <janesez@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: one big happy family

Hey SOMMSters....

        This whole FIVE HORIZONS vs. SOMMS thing has gotten way out of
hand. First of all, Caryn Rose's response to Nick was extremely
inappropriate and rude! But that's really besides the fact. Nick had a
good idea and somehow it got totally blown out of context!

We all really need to remember one important (well, at leat i think its
important)


The main reason I love this ML so much is becuase I have no one here
where I live that can relate with me about music..and music is my
life..really..soundgarden is my life. It might seem sad and pathetic to
me but its the honest truth. Without you guys I'd be lost. What I'm
trying to say is that just like we shouldn't fight with eachother...we
shouldn't argue with the PJ fans either. PJ happens to be my #2 fave
band..you know...its like all of those early SUBPOP bands are one big
'family'. We come from the same roots...you know what I mean? We're all
we've got so we shouldn't waste it on pointless bitching and moaning.
Really.

Rachel*





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------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 22:55:26 -0400
From:    Bill Hawthorne <Bill.Hawthorne@VDFNET.COM>
Subject: (fwd) Renewal of your subscription to the SOMMS list

Fri, 8 May 1998 06:00:33

Your subscription to  the SOMMS list is  due for renewal. If  you wish to
remain  subscribed  to  SOMMS,  please issue  the  following  command  to
LISTSERV@MITVMA.MIT.EDU  (or  LISTSERV@MITVMA.BITNET)  at  your  earliest
convenience:

                              CONFIRM SOMMS

You will  be automatically  removed from the  list if you  do not  send a
CONFIRM command within the next 7 days.

PS: In  order to  facilitate the  task, this  message has  been specially
formatted   so   that   you   only   need   to   forward   it   back   to
LISTSERV@MITVMA.MIT.EDU (or  LISTSERV@MITVMA.BITNET) to have  the command
executed. Note that while the formats produced by the forwarding function
of most mail  packages are supported, replying will seldom  work, so make
sure to forward and not reply.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
// JOB
CONFIRM SOMMS
// EOJ

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 12 May 1998 00:01:01 EDT
From:    SokJunky55 <SokJunky55@AOL.COM>
Subject: zeh dotu thingy single mabob

yups.  im gonna haveta agree with the peeps who said rhinosaur and zero
chance.   after the break up, i heard zero chance played ONCE on the radio,
and i HELLA hear rhinosaur played.  it kiks ass!!  theyre not just playing the
singles!!   oh mans.   zero chance... how rite that person was who said it
would change the way people think.  mans, if anyone was paying attention to my
post about zero chance, you all know what it means to me.   man.  what a
song...

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 11 May 1998 23:13:02 -0500
From:    Jon-Paul Andolina <jonas22@ISO.NET>
Subject: What i saw about the whole Seattle gathering thing

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0020_01BD7D32.586B3660
Content-Type: text/plain;
        charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I think some people got the wrong idea about the whole gathering thing =
(or i could be wrong im just pitching pennines here) what i got out of =
it is this...
SOMMSters get pj Seattle show tickets, SOMMSters decide to try to meet =
up there, SOMMSters wonder if people from 5H want to join, small =
ramblings about promotion, seeing bandmembers and the like....

someone tell me if im wrong about that but why did everyone get riled up =
about this
sounded like it coulda been real cool (even thought id never be able to =
make it) but now it looks like it fell apart but the main thing i got =
out of it was that some SOMMSters were going to the show and were gonna =
get together and wanted to know if people from 5H wanted to join

sorry if the typing is bad or the language is garbled i just broke a =
finger in my left hand and one-handed typing sucks

jpa

------=_NextPart_000_0020_01BD7D32.586B3660
Content-Type: text/html;
        charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.71.1712.3"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I think some people got the wrong =
idea about the=20
whole gathering thing (or i could be wrong im just pitching pennines =
here) what=20
i got out of it is this...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>SOMMSters get pj Seattle show tickets, SOMMSters =
decide to try=20
to meet up there, SOMMSters wonder if people from 5H want to join, small =

ramblings about promotion, seeing bandmembers and the =
like....</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>someone tell me if im wrong about that but why did =
everyone=20
get riled up about this</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>sounded like it coulda been real cool (even thought =
id never=20
be able to make it) but now it looks like it fell apart but the main =
thing i got=20
out of it was that some SOMMSters were going to the show and were gonna =
get=20
together and wanted to know if people from 5H wanted to =
join</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>sorry if the typing is bad or the language is =
garbled i just=20
broke a finger in my left hand and one-handed typing sucks</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>jp<FONT =
color=3D#000000>a</FONT></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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------------------------------

End of SOMMS Digest - 11 May 1998 to 12 May 1998
************************************************