From: somms@mit.edu To: somms-digest@mit.edu Subject: Soundgarden Digest, Saturday, 8 Mar 1997 Reply-To: somms@mit.edu Date: Sat, 08 Mar 1997 14:14:02 EST Sender: saperl The Soundgarden Digest: Saturday, 8 Mar 1997 listadmin: saperl@mit.edu list archive: http://www.sgi.net/soundgarden/archive/ TO UNSUBSCRIBE: email saperl@mit.edu Today's Topics: Snakes, dogs, and band names. Re: Snakes, dogs, and band names. Bootlegging... bootlegs = theft Boot trading Hype/Chris's Tattoo Grooooooooovy stuff... FS: "Limited" vinyl Re: Initials, Bootlegs, & Dueling Poets Who's that woman with Chris??? Re: Booty Call Re: Booty Call LISTENING TO SOUNDGARDEN IS REALLY GOOD FOR YOU. . .REALLY. . .I MEAN IT! the bootleg issue Re: Hype/Chris's Tattoo Re: Booty Call Re: Boot trading Re: Grooooooooovy stuff... Re: the bootleg issue Re: Booty Call Early photo of Matt Re: boots, etc. sorry bootlegs Re: Hype/Chris's Tattoo Re: Soundgarden Digest, Friday, 7 Mar 1997 Observations Chris' Silver Porsche Home to Meet MOM?! Royalties and such Good and Bad News Boot the habit! Re: *CD* bootlegs=theft Re: *CD* bootlegs=theft Re: *CD* bootlegs=theft Stamp out bootlegging! Chris needs a new Porsche :-) ------------------------------------------------------------ From: me Subject: Snakes, dogs, and band names. I recently looked at the top 20 singles chart, and came upon a band that goes by the name "Savage Garden" there single is at number 16. Does any one know anything about this band. This is the second band I have noticed that have, garden in there name, the other was "Mirror Garden". So much for catchy band names these days. Anyways that isnt what I wanted to post about. Dogs, river's, mother, jesus, snakes,and fire. what do all of theese things have in common? They are things that often appear in SoundGarden songs, mainly the songs that Chris writes. Hmmm.... Feel free to elaborate on this subject. Till next time... Goodnight ********************************* Time for guess what song these lyrics are from!! "She turns the knife around" "I watch her run it down her side" "Kisses my fingers when I go by" "See my mother in her eyes." E-mail me the correct song title and I will tell you, that your are cool. ------------------------------ From: Stella Rogers Subject: Re: Snakes, dogs, and band names. On Thu, 6 Mar 1997, me wrote: > I recently looked at the top 20 singles chart, and came upon a band that > goes by the name "Savage Garden" there single is at number 16. Does any > one know anything about this band. I've heard this band before. They have a song that gets constant radio play where I live. They're nothing like Soundgarden. They're just another Euro-pop dance band. ------------------------------ Subject: Bootlegging... From: Brydon Cheyney CS95 >if soundgarden wanted to prevent bootlegging, the best thing they could do >would be to openly allow taping of their shows. imagine if they had a >taping section, or allowed tape recorders in... anyone on this list could >bring a tape recorder in, we would all have tapes of shows and NO ONE >would go buy a bootleg. no one would profit off of soundgarden (except >maybe maxell, sony and TDK ;->). we would have tape trees, anyone who >wanted a show could make their own copy, or trade for one easily. the >bootleggers wouldn't have much of a market because we would all have >copies of those shows... It's the only way... The Dead have been doing it for aeons, the Black Crowes are open to it, as were Metallica on the 'Wherever I May Roam' tour, where you could get a pass to shoot video at the concert... I mean, have you ever seen the wealth of Metallica boots? It's out of hand! I mean, Metallica hardly ever change their Goddamn show, same setlist almost every night... If you've got one boot from the tour you've got em all... But people are always going to buy bootlegs... Unfortunately it's usually the hardcore fans that are shelling out for the inferior copy of the real thing, and the band loses out too... Maybe not so much financially, I don't think SG are in this business solely for the money, but if the band know the fans are picking up poor quality boots of their live shows... It's degrading... These bootleggers are making a profit off SG's artistic talent and hard work... Brydon - -- "God created Women... But the Devil invented the Blues..." ------------------------------ From: "Jason Thompson" Subject: bootlegs = theft >Please have a little empathy for the integrity of artists when considering >paying someone for stolen art. I agree, these assholes that sell these cd's for $50+ are a rip off. Personally, the most I've paid for a boot is $25, which is still too much. I really don't think the band is losing any money on boots though. Personally I own about 50-60 different Soundgarden and Soundgarden related cd's(10 boots), so I don't feel that I'm taking money from their pockets. I really don't think the band minds people having boot shows as long as they've bought at least the regular albums. Chris started his music collection with stolen Beetles and Sabbath records. These weren't boot shows either, but regular albums he stole from a neighbor. I bet the Beetles are pretty pissed, some kid got free copies of their work and went on to be a great musician/song writer (at least in all of our opinions, right?) I don't mean to say 2 wrongs make a right, but considering Chris stole his records, he probably doesn't mind people trading shows (who knows?). The main reason I collect boots is to get songs that aren't available(Stolen Prayers, American Woman) on any of the releases or are different versions (BHS solo). I wouldn't pay $25 for a show that was just live versions similar to the studio versions, but I would probably trade for a tape of that show. The band could possibly solve the problem by selling 1-2 live shows from each tour, as well as some of the demos and other stuff. If they sold this stuff through the fan club, they would make some money and add incentive to be in the fan club at the same time. If there were official releases through the fan club, they could be touched up and remastered and would blow away some of those shitty boots that are available. Maybe then, boots would become less desirable, and the boot cd makers would be out of business as far as Soundgarden goes. I wish that these shows and demos were available through the fan club so that my money would go to the band and not some asshole who copied a tape, but they aren't. Maybe the fact that I need every Soundgarden song is a problem, but I think all of us are SG nuts in some way or another. I would much rather trade for the shows on tape, and take the expense and the assholes out of the equation. If you've looked around for traders like I have, you know that there aren't many SG traders on many of the trading pages on the web. Even when there are, you generally need to have someting that they need. You also have to worry about getting ripped off by traders. Sometimes shelling out $25 is easier than all the hassle of trading. ------------------------------ From: "Jason Thompson" Subject: Boot trading This would be a good chance to see how many tape traders we have on the list. Maybe someone with an account could set up a trade page for list members? (Steve, someone ). I know someone distributed a b-side tape a while back, so I'm sure Seth wouldn't mind (hopefully). If no one wants to do a page, I could do an email listing of traders on the list and what shows they have to trade. If you are a tape trader, then send me email and let me know if you would be interested in trading audio or video tapes of Soundgarden with other list members. If we get enough people involved, we could get some newbies started off also. Don't post to the list though, I'm sure Seth has enough on his hands. send mail to jdt19@csufresno.edu ------------------------------ From: mark filleman Subject: Hype/Chris's Tattoo Several people on the list have mentioned ordering Hype from Australia. Does anybody have a phone number or address where I can obtain a copy ? I'd greatly appreciate it. Also, in response to an inquiry made last week about the meaning of Chris's tattoo-I believe I read here that it is a Chinese symbol of his wife's birthsign or at least has something to do with her. Can anyone confirm this ? Finally, thanks to everyone who wrote about the Grammy's-I taped them but almost recorded over it until I found out that Chris and Susan were there. The 5 second shot of them was about the only entertaing thing on the whole damn show. There was a pretty good shot of Chris clapping after the big " Waiting to Exhale " performance and oddly enough-he looked like he really dug it. How weird is that ? Take care for now. Kristen F. ------------------------------ From: ShRooMGrLz@aol.com Subject: Grooooooooovy stuff... First off, thanks a billion to everyone for their excellent birthday wish= es (especially the ones that involved Chris. ;-) It made my 23rd, and extremely happy one. (But STILL no naked pictures of the band, dammit.) Heheheh... Dun-Wei wrote: >Chris is aesthetically pleasing, ie. fly...(those who disagree can=20 >take it up with Shroomy, who will promptly disembowel you).=20 Oh c'mon... give me SOME credit. I could come up with something a hell o= f alot worse than just a simple disembowelment. Such as being forced to: - - Watch reruns of MTV's "The Real World" part one. (As a side note to thi= s, I finally saw the latest version of this program and I must say... the gay = guy, Dan, has got to be the second most gorgeous guy I've ever seen in my life. Sorry Dave, sorry Stoney... but are any of you familiar with the sensati= on of seeing a person that is SO stunningly gorgeous, that it's actually pai= nful to look at them? That is this guy. OUCH. Oh, and who remembers Neil fr= om a past Real World? Damn, they find some hot guys for that show. Ok, I'll = stop babbling about this now.) - - Listen to Axl Rose sing. (This man also causes me a certain kind of pai= n, and it's located... oh never mind, I'm sure you get the point.) - - Make out with Rush Limbaugh. (This one is particularly repulsive.) >Shroomy: I checked out your Eddie V. vampire page. Hilarious! =20 >Then I checked out your Chris shrine. You have some problems. =20 >Deep seated mental problems. You are, as we say in the asian=20 >community, a few egg rolls short of a combination platter. =20 >STALK CHRIS MUCH, SHROOMY??!! Just kidding. I think. Glad you liked the page! But I don't have any more problems than any oth= er hootchie out there. I'm just have a tendency to... share my feelings wit= h the group. Stalking? Nope, I wouldn't do that. That's illegal, and I'm above that. But if I *do* happen to get arrested for... illegal activiti= es surrounding Soundgarden... I'll be sure to do it in a blaze of Hard Copy camera action. =3D) Hey, maybe Geoffmeister could make up some video ca= ptures to put up on the page of me being lead off in handcuffs or something. Mmmm... handcuffs. Oh, sorry. Anyway, Chris Cornell happens to be my o= wn personal favorite deity. So allow me to wallow in the depths of my obses= sion in relative peace, ok? ;-) Benlover wrote: >34 year old Matt Cameron, drummer of legendary band Soundgarden,=20 >has reportedly caught sight of Chris Cornell's chlone!=20 >Think of it all!!! A memeber of Soundgarden for each of us! Then it >wouldn't really matter if Chris were married, would it??? WHOAH, woman you are a GENIUS! Cloning... why in the hell didn't I think= of it?? Can you kiddies just IMAGINE the possibilities?? A person could ha= ve a regular HAREM of rockstars! I'd have to have at least two Chris Cornell'= s and one each of the following: Dave Navarro, Stoney Gossard, Mike Patton,= Dan and Neil from The Real World, Jerry Cantrell, Trent Reznor, Gavin Rossdal= e (hey gag all you want at his music, but I've met the guy and he's absolut= ely charming in person; not to mention a complete babe) and to make things interesting... throw in a Harry Connick, Jr. =3D) Oh yeah, life would b= e sweet then. And you're totally right, girlie... we wouldn't have to worr= y about anyone being married. Susan would have the original Chris, and we would have CCCC's. (Carbon Copy Chris Cornell's) =20 Oh hey... someone had posted recently about Soundgarden Haikus, so I gues= s that this would be the perfect time for me to unveil the "Soundgarden Hai= kus" page. I compiled them from past digests (Grote rules): http://members.aol.com/shroomgrlz/sghaikus.html And do you consider yourself obsessed with Soundgarden? Well, you'll fin= d yourself in good company on the "You know you're obsessed with Soundgarde= n when..." page. (Also compiled from past digests, so if you posted one... then it's on this page): http://members.aol.com/shroomgrlz/obsessed.html That's all for now, kiddies. Love me, bye-bye... Your Official SOMMS Hootchie, Shroom Girl "Insert lecherous mention or gratuitous comment about Chris Cornell and h= is sexy body here." ~ Shroom Girl, Inc. =99 '97 ------------------------------ Subject: FS: "Limited" vinyl From: Ben Timberlake > I have a limited edition copy of the Down On The Upside vinyl for sale to > the highest offer...this is the black vinyl version as i understand theyre > are two versions. Mail me personally as i am not a list member..thanks. > cbrown@falcon.lhup.edu just an FYI, anyone who is going to buy this... this is NOT that limited, there are TONS of copies out there, and you shouldn't pay more than what it was released for... more than $20 is highway robbery.... In fact, there's a used copy at a local store for $10. I'd offer to pick it up for someone, but I'm absolutely broke. If you're in the chicago area, though, and have a need for it, email me and I'll tell you where it is. -- Ben Ben Timberlake Can't you see? I want out. Northwestern University I'm alone and I'm an easy target. Medill School of Journalism pubweb.acns.nwu.edu/~bft718 btimlake@nwu.edu -30- Plan for life, in order of importance: 1. Do what makes a difference 2. Do what makes you feel good 3. Do what you're good at 4. Do what makes you a living ------------------------------ From: Mercyhurst Prep Library Subject: Re: Initials, Bootlegs, & Dueling Poets So let's use Sg or Sgarden or the Gardners. I used to think SG could also mean Stone Gossard. Not that that's a bad thing at all, so just put it into context! At 01:55 PM 3/6/97 -0600, you wrote: > Hey There > >A few things I've been pondering. I'll keep it brief for those who don't care. > >1) I never thought about the abbreviation SG being mistaken (?) as someone >talking about the Spice Girls. Ouch. ------------------------------ From: tonerkin Subject: Who's that woman with Chris??? >Shroom wrote: >And do you consider yourself obsessed with Soundgarden? I have seen some recent examples of those obsessions poping up in the form of pictures of a band member and their girlfriend/wife that the signicficant others face is removed and a obsessed sommster's face is inserted!!!! Some our quite impressive BUTT Seth the color of that dress is all wrong for your hair color in the one of you and Matt!!! :))) toni ------------------------------ From: Mercyhurst Prep Library Subject: Re: Booty Call Wow, some good stuff waiting for me on the list this morning. I've read all the pros and cons and here's my next 2 cents on it. I still say there's no need for people to buy the high priced and usually poor quality CD boots. Get into the trading circuit and once again--buy a Goldmine newspaper and check out all the classified ads that traders have in there. I've been doing this since 1985 for various bands, and I'm sorry, but I'm not enough of a fan of ANY band to shell out $40-50 for aCD bootleg. Why?? B/c I know it's floating around out there on the trade circuit of whatever band it is, and the quality may be better. So I'm in total agreement wit, was it Caryn, who objected to those who tape w/ the purpose of selling. I said that earlier this week when this string came up. Do I look upon taping as hurting a band? No, not really. I do acknowledge that it's considered illegal HOWEVER speaking from the p.o.v. of someone who's done this for a long time for various bands, I also happen to look at it as a way to keep up the interest between albums and tours, and to share the concert experiences from alot of other locales. What I, and it seems others, have a problem with is those who SELL the stuff. Usually those who sell aren't even fans of a band, they're just out to make $ off the real fans! At 11:40 PM 3/6/97 -0500, Toni wrote: > All this talk about bootlegs also go hand in hand with ticket scalping. >It becomes a moral issue and we fans are put in the middle. I want tickets >to go to a show but they are sold out by the time I get to the ticket >window!! What do I do?? I really want to see the concert and the only way >is to buy scalper tickets. Now Toni has opened a whole new string for us, tho it is related in essence. Scalpers! Oh, actually 2 strings---what about sharing the music w/ those who have no access, like in a foreign country. OK, on to scalpers first. I've only once ever bought tix from a scalper and that was b/c the tix I'd bought thru TMaster were like last row, nosebleed heaven seats, and I was able to buy 7th row tix for $50 each ror something equally reasonable. But in general, from what I hear, scalpers are the lowest of the low, asking outrageous prices. But it's the fans who keep them going, b/c fans of some bands are soooo desperate to see a band...like PJ on that last rravesty of a tour when it was on again/off again....was that the last tour or the one before? If fans didn't shell out the bucks, scalpers wouldn't succeed, but as long as fans are willing to do so, scalpers will keep cirleing like sharks knowing they can rake in huge $ for needed tix! Probably the only way to stop scalpers is for more bands to set up strict sales practices. This other issue Toni raised, about taping for those w/ no access....I do it. I share my Inflatable Soule music with anyone who really wants it. I usually don't tape the "current" album b/c people can send for it, but the older, out of stock stuff I tape freely. OK, that's a bad example b/c Peter told me to share the old stuff w/ new fans. But I see nothing wrong w/ taping for someone who is either curious about the music and/or has no way of getting hold of it. It is considered illegal, but can't we also consider it spreading the music to new fans? They'd buy it if they could, why deprive them? I agree w/ Toni that it's giving a gift of music to that fan! And she's also right that there are no hard and fast rules we can follow. We're all individuals and we all have our opinions. For some, like me, those opinions mean there are a few things I do and don't do, and none of it is right or wrong. Also speaking for myself, I enjoy having discussions like this b/c I like to hear the opinions of my fellow fans. It does impact us all as Sg fans ro fans of any other band we happen to like! have a good friday.....ciao....deb ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Booty Call From: jsimpson@mail03.mitre.org (Jamesetta Simpson) >Toni worte: > All this talk about bootlegs also go hand in hand with ticket scalping. >It becomes a moral issue and we fans are put in the middle. I >don't know what the hard and fast rules are for these dilemmas or if there >are any. I think we all have to make a judgement call and live with our >decision. toni Along with ticket scalping let's talk used CD's!! A new CD comes out and if you want it new you can pay from $15 up for it (and from what I'm told much more in countries other that the US). But if you wait for a few weeks you can pick up the same CD in a used shop for half the price. Case in point I got the DOTU the day it came out for $16. I now see them all the time for $6 and $7. The resale of a CD does take money out of the pockets of recording artist and I'm sure that is part of the reason the original cost for a CD has gone up. On the other hand you have the used shops putting outrageous prices on CD's that are considered "rare". Example the SOMMs disk - I have seen dealers put a price tag on it for $30 and up. I picked my copy up for $10. In any case Soundgarden doesn't see a penny of this money. Should a recording artist get a cut of this money - but wouldn't that make the cost go up!! As Toni said it's a judgement call on our part. I sure don't want my used shops to go away or make their prices higher. Jamie (Village Idiot/SOMMs Mom - talk about sitting in the middle of a fence) ------------------------------ From: CL Miller Subject: LISTENING TO SOUNDGARDEN IS REALLY GOOD FOR YOU. . .REALLY. . .I MEAN IT! Hey there kiddies! I am enclosing a copy of my Statistical Research experiment from last semester for your reading enjoyment. Soundgarden, bless their hearts, got me an "A"! LISTENING TO SOUNDGARDEN DECREASES THE GROWTH AND DEVELOPMENT OF THE RYEGRASS PLANT Christopher L. Miller Psychology Department Clarion University of Pennsylvania Abstract: Listening to Soundgarden (a popular Seattle grunge-rock band) will decrease the growth of ryegrass plants. 10 plants listened to a Soundgarden song and 10 were used as a control group. After measuring the height of the plants and then analyzing the data, I rejected the null hypothesis. Introduction: I thought that listening to Soundgarden would decrease the plants' growth. With all of the controversy trying to prove how rock music is detrimental to today's youth, I wanted to prove that listening to rock music can have a negative effect on growth and development. Methods: SUBJECTS Thirty Agway Annual Ryegrass seeds were randomly assigned to a control group and to an experimental group. There were, therefore, fifteen subjects in each group. Of the 15 in the control group, all 15 sprouted and five later died. Of the 15 in the experimental group, 11 sprouted and one later died. All plants were treated exactly the same with the exception of the experimental group being subjected to the Soundgarden music. APPARATUS Two halves of a paper Mong's 2% milk carton were used in order to contain the seeds and soil. Metal staples were used to seal up the ends of the cartons and a #2 lead pencil was used to pierce holes in the bottom of the cartons for drainage. A 12-inch ruler with millimeter measurement was used in order to measure the plants. The independant variable was the Soundgarden song "Black Hole Sun" which is a release from their 1994 album SuperUnknown. The music was played on a Technics 5-disc CD changer through a Technics 200-watt receiver through JVC 200- watt speakers. My music studio was used in order to isolate the experimental group from the control group.Damp Hyponex brand potting soil (purchased from K-Mart) was used for growing the seeds. Tap water was used to water the seeds and soil. PROCEDURES Each half of the milk carton was pierced with the pencil in order to provide drainage. Then, about one inch of potting soil was placed into each half and lightly packed. The cartons were then placed in about 2-3 inches of tap water in the kitchen sink and allowed to soak for three hours. The sink was then drained and the cartons allowed to dry overnight. The next day, 15 seeds were randomly selected and randomly sprinkled over each carton. The seeds were then gently pressed about 2/3 of their length into the soil and lightly covered with a 1/4 inch layer of potting soil. The cartons were labeled "C" for the control group, and "E" for the experimental group. The groups were then placed near a small window for light. The plants were then checked for sprouting on a daily basis. Three days after they had been planted, I noticed small sprouts emerging from the soil. The experimental group grew 15 plants (5 died). The control group grew 11 plants (1 died). The plants were watered lightly with a sink-sprayer each day in order to remain moist. One week after the plants had sprouted, (10 days after they had been planted) the experimental group was moved into my studio and placed on the floor in front of the stereo speaker. The song "Black Hole Sun" was then played at volume 4 once every 10 minutes, for 5 times total. After the plants were done listening to the song for the 5th time, they were placed back on the window shelf with the control group. 14 days after the seeds had sprouted (17 days after they were planted), the plants were uprooted, measured from root to tip, and placed in the corresponding envelopes marked "Control Group" and "Experimental Group". Results: Using the Mann-Whitney U, the Uobt was 17 and the Ucrit was 27, therefore, I rejected the null-hypothesis. The average height of the Control group was 150.83 mm. The average height of the Experimental group was 102.08. Refer to Figure 1. Discussion: The experimental hypothesis stated that listening to Soundgarden would decrease growth and development of the ryegrass. Mann-Whitney U was used because this experiment was a between subjects design. The average heights of the groups also coincided with the experimental hypothesis, therefore, becuase the independent variable (listening to Soundgarden's "Black Hole Sun") was the only difference between the groups, I concluded that the experimental hypothesis is true. Listening to Soundgarden has a negative effect on the growth of ryegrass plants. *********** So. . .the moral of this story is. . .thank God we're not plants! - -- Check out my store's site!! http://www.MovieStop.com/ My personal video favorites of the week: Feeling Minnesota Basquiat ------------------------------ From: Vince Varkey Subject: the bootleg issue Here's my thoughts on bootlegging: I am ok with it. When I bought Fresh Deadly Rarities, I bought it solely on the fact that it has 10+ songs on it that were semi-new to me and ones that I either had a shitty recording of, or I didn't have at all. That is why I shelled out my 27 bucks to get it. Did I pay too much? Yeah, probably, but I thijnk it is reasonable. But being a SG fan, I want to get as much quality material as I can from them and when presented with FDR, it was simply too good to pass up. Looking back, I do feel a little bad that Soundgarden never got my 27 bucks. But at the time, I never even thought about it. All I was fixated on was the fact that in my hands was a CD with a lot of great new songs on it. I think that is what it boils down to. Like Ross said, whoever buys a boot, chances are, is a true fan of the band. Anyway, the best way to combat dealers selling boots 200% or 300% over its actual value is to not buy them. - -vince ------------------------------ From: Caryn Rose Subject: Re: Hype/Chris's Tattoo On Fri, 7 Mar 1997, mark filleman wrote: > Several people on the list have mentioned ordering Hype from > Australia. Does anybody have a phone number or address where I can > obtain a copy ? erm... US sommsters thinking this is an easy way to get hype! early -- remember that Australia has a *different* video format than we do. They are PAL format, just like Europe, and that means you need a special tv and video in order to watch it... and converting from PAL to NTSC (US format) can be expensive... it was a good movie, but not so amazing that you couldn't wait until it comes out in US format later this year! ;-> - --caryn ------------------------------ From: Caryn Rose Subject: Re: Booty Call On Fri, 7 Mar 1997, Jamesetta Simpson wrote: > Along with ticket scalping let's talk used CD's!! A new CD comes out and > if you want it new you can pay from $15 up for it (and from what I'm told > much more in countries other that the US). But if you wait for a few weeks > you can pick up the same CD in a used shop for half the price. Case in > point I got the DOTU the day it came out for $16. I now see them all the > time for $6 and $7. The resale of a CD does take money out of the pockets > of recording artist and I'm sure that is part of the reason the original > cost for a CD has gone up. actually, not at all. in fact, manufacturing prices have *dropped* -- the reason the cost for a CD has gone up has ZERO to do with actual manufacturing cost, but greed. greed of the *record companies*, not the artists involved. in a nutshell, all of the labels these days are owned by these huge multi-media conglomerates, and the only division that is profitable for them is the record division. so it's not enough that they have 100% profit or 200% profit, they must carry the entire company... i view used cd's the same way i view home taping: it allows me to hear music i otherwise wouldn't, and if i *like* it, i always go and buy something by that artist at full price. if i had to buy at full price every record i ever wanted to hear, i'd never take a chance on a new artist -- but paying $7 for something I might like allows me that chance. if i don't like it, big deal, i can resell it. if i had to pay $16 for that chance, it would mean i could take far less chances. i mean, did any of us go and buy DotU used? no, we wanted it RIGHT AWAY. the person who buys DotU used might get turned on to sg's other music and go buy BMF or something else at full price. what comes around goes around... it's like used books. I had heard about this one sf author, but not being much of a sf fan, didn't want to pay full price for a book i might not even finish, so i bought one used for $3. I loved it so much i ran out and bought the rest of her books at full price. this reminds me of a debate on the neil young list... there are quite a few albums of his that are completely out of print, unless you're lucky enough to find a used LP somewhere. some people on the list will not tolerate others taping copies of the album, arguing it's money out of neil's pocket; others say, 'hey, i'd buy it if it was available, this is the only way for me to hear it, and when and if it gets reissued, i'll STILL go out and buy a copy!' i tend to agree with the latter position myself.... also, buying used cd's and vinyl is good for the environment, less wasteful! ;-> i'm not even going to touch jamie's scalping comment as we've had that debate before. i try as hard as I can NOT to patronize them.... to the point that it meant missing pearl jam in a small club here because i refused to pay $150 for a ticket. I had the money, and it would have obviously been well worth the price.... i just couldn't do it. i just couldn't. but that is *me*, and not anyone else, and all i'm trying to do with this discussion is bring up other viewpoints.... like the used cd discussion above, i hadn't thought about it that way until jamie brought it up.... - --caryn ------------------------------ From: Caryn Rose Subject: Re: Boot trading On Fri, 7 Mar 1997, Jason Thompson wrote: > This would be a good chance to see how many tape traders we have on the > list. Maybe someone with an account could set up a trade page for list > members? (Steve, someone ). I know someone distributed a > b-side tape a while back, so I'm sure Seth wouldn't mind (hopefully). If > no one wants to do a page, I could do an email listing of traders on the > list and what shows they have to trade. this would be a HUGE list. why not create a web page? get a space on geocities or tripod for free... have you seen the pearl jam trader's page? http://www-personal.usyd.edu.au/~mgallagh/ it's a central location where tapers/traders can register and have links to their lists, so if you want pj, you can go there and find everyone in one place. i think a similar venture for sg would be cool, especially since it's a smaller group and it's not the huge undertaking that the pj trader's page is... - --caryn ------------------------------ From: Caryn Rose Subject: Re: Grooooooooovy stuff... On Fri, 7 Mar 1997 ShRooMGrLz@aol.com wrote: > >Shroomy: I checked out your Eddie V. vampire page. Hilarious! let me second this, because some sick hootchie out there thought i might have been OFFENDED. LOL! ;-) (although, shroom, i can't believe you didn't work the space needle shot in there somehow... ;->) > >Then I checked out your Chris shrine. You have some problems. > >Deep seated mental problems. You are, as we say in the asian > >community, a few egg rolls short of a combination platter. > >STALK CHRIS MUCH, SHROOMY??!! Just kidding. I think. you've obviously never visited The Temple of Chris Cornell! > Oh hey... someone had posted recently about Soundgarden Haikus, so I guess > that this would be the perfect time for me to unveil the "Soundgarden Haikus" > page. I compiled them from past digests (Grote rules): > http://members.aol.com/shroomgrlz/sghaikus.html this is so frickin' funny! i had wanted to do this... i think i might have some saved somewhere... > And do you consider yourself obsessed with Soundgarden? Well, you'll find > yourself in good company on the "You know you're obsessed with Soundgarden > when..." page. (Also compiled from past digests, so if you posted one... > then it's on this page): > http://members.aol.com/shroomgrlz/obsessed.html this absolutley has to be the BEST. ;-) i especially like seth's.... *sigh* those were the days... - --caryn ------------------------------ From: chewy Subject: Re: the bootleg issue I don't post much, but I thought I'd put my $.02 in : I personally feel bootlegs are acceptable, to a certain point. Sure, it's not fair to the band that they receive no money from the production and selling of bootlegs, but, the U.S. music industry seems to feel that live CDs are bad or won't sell, and rarely ever release any. I think that if the music industry in the U.S. released a live CD or two for bands on tour, the "illegal" bootleg/import market would drop off. A live CD professionally made (I mean by Sony/A&M/etc.) would only cost the same, or a little more than a normal CD. Example : Nirvana...the 'new' Muddy Banks... costs the same as a regular CD. If that was the case, people would not have to shell out $25+ for these imported live CDs, which are not always top quality either. I will continue to buy bootlegs (for reasonable prices...$90 for Push is ridiculous), but only because I enjoy the live music more, and this is the only way for me to get it right now. Maybe my views will change if I see SG live... I still think the bootleg market would not exist if the U.S. music industry released more live albums. my $.02, chewy ------------------------------ From: "Jean G. Bruns" Subject: Re: Booty Call Caryn said: > i mean, did any of us go and buy DotU used? no, we wanted it RIGHT AWAY. well, i bought the vinyl RIGHT AWAY (sensing it might not be available too long) & bought the CD used later. hard to find used, btw :) > also, buying used cd's and vinyl is good for the environment, less > wasteful! ;-> indeed! re: boots i used to buy them (very limited amounts; too expensive, mislabeled, sometimes poor quality, etc). now i collect tapes. soooo easy to get high quality stuff, esp. with net access. in addition, there are tons of shows you can get by trading tapes that AREN'T available on boot CDs. and yes, tapes DO wear out over time; dub yourself a backup. there IS another issue re: boots. some ppl simply don't have tape decks. they have CD players at home & in their cars. so they feel they are stuck with buying boot CDs. i sorta understand this. some ppl are now burning their own CDs from DAT or analog tape, simply so they can have music in the format they prefer. my preference: videos :) trade trade trade; its a great way to meet some cool ppl, too. jean ------------------------------ Subject: Early photo of Matt From: seth Mr. Endino says: "...found an old photo of Skin '85 that I managed to enlarge off a proof sheet!" http://www.nwlink.com/~endino/photo0.html This is the oldest photo I've seen of Matt. Though the most humorous would probably be http://www.sgi.net/soundgarden/images/hammer0494-7.jpg seth ------------------------------ From: SJordet@aol.com Subject: Re: boots, etc. Lorraine wrote: >first of all, I *don't* think Chris drives a porche. Mind if I correct you, dearie? In the July of '96 issue of Spin (Volume 12, number 4) a section of the article states: "...we're speeding along in his (Chris') gleaming silver 1978 Porsche Targa, one of the trophies of Soundgarden's long, steady march to success." Something which I am *very* jealous of, by the way. I doubt he drives this hummer around everywhere, just when he's at home in Seattle - and even then it might stick out more than he would wish. Oh, well. The point is, he has it, and I want it. 'Nother thing - I keep reading the replies to posts before the actual posts. Somebody'll comment on something someone else said, and then'll I'll read the original post that's being commented on five or six posts down the line. It doesn't bother me too much, but sometimes it gets quite confusing. Is this normal? Am I doing something? I'm fairly computer illiterate - if the whole thing weren't run on a point and click basis I wouldn't be a SOMMSter (good news for some of you, I'm guessing ;). AND - I want to thank Seth for all the time he puts into the page. You're just an amazing guy. I know I wouldn't have half the energy to keep that thing running the way it is, and it's just packed full of everything. I've been to several unofficial websites after becoming a SOMMSter, and they all pale in comparison. Even the semi-official Tool site is a bit drab. I checked out the unofficial Lyle Lovett page (my latest obsession) and I must say I'm *very* disapointed in what's there. I guess I've been spoiled by Seth's amazing devotion to the band. (A little butt-kissing never hurts, right??? ;) The words "short" and "post" are not in my vocabulary, in case you haven't noticed ;), Benlover P.S. - Did y'all know that the guy who designed the Porsche was born in September??? VRIGOS RULE!!!!! =) ------------------------------ From: SJordet@aol.com Subject: sorry Sorry to those of you whom this doesn't apply to: Lisa! I lost your E-Mail address!! I was replying to a message from you and the stupid AOL (did I mention AOL sucks?) kicked me off! Please get it to me soon! Soundgarden content...uhhh, oh! I have one!! If you were trying to convince your parents that Soundgarden was made up of good, clean (for the most part) guys, which one member would you bring home to meet them...? I, of course, would go for Ben. Yeah, yeah. I know what most of you have to say to that, but I don't care. Benlover ------------------------------ From: DAVID DEBOLT Subject: bootlegs I agree with whoever said it. The bootleg CD industry would be out of business if bands allowed the real fans to make copies for themselves. Also, with the exception of Unplugged, when was the last time a decent band put out a live album that regular people can buy, for a reasonable price. That would stop the theives who charge $30 for a CD, and base their company in Europe to avoid copyright violation laws of the US. Just a thought..... David PS-i have a few shows if people want to trade, or if you don't have any to trade I will sell them for the amount it costs me (about $3.00). ------------------------------ From: Taylor Holmes Subject: Re: Hype/Chris's Tattoo Caryn Rose wrote: > > On Fri, 7 Mar 1997, mark filleman wrote: > > > Several people on the list have mentioned ordering Hype from > > Australia. Does anybody have a phone number or address where I can > > obtain a copy ? > > erm... US sommsters thinking this is an easy way to get hype! early -- > remember that Australia has a *different* video format than we do. > They are PAL format, just like Europe,... Youknowyou'reobsessedwithSoundgardenwhen you live in the US and you purchase the early Austrailian release of Hype!, as well as a special TV and VCR just to watch the SG parts of Hype! at home before most other American's... ;-) - -- D. Taylor Holmes Senior Quality Assurance Analyst, Automated Test Coordinator Datastream Systems Software, Inc. home: holmest@netdepot.com work: holmest@dstm.com ------------------------------ From: Fiona Thiessen Subject: Re: Soundgarden Digest, Friday, 7 Mar 1997 Carol (Slave4cc), the lyrics in Smells like TS are "a *mulatto*, an albino, a mosquito, my libido yeah" not being nasty, just clearing it up. Yeah, I too think they don't exactly add anything, in terms of imagery, effect etc to the song, but Kurt said that he was merely playing with opposites. A mulatto is a child born with one parent white and the other black, or to that affect. Thanks Caryn for informing everyone about "cbrown@falcon.lhup.edu" and her ltd (!) DOTU black vinyl. In Australia it came out on "ltd clear vinyl", but I can get it from the stores near me still, so other Australians...don't fall for people like the aforementioned. : ) Orko, bit of tolerance maybe. It's because others on the list want to know what made us (non buyers of bootlegs) decide to do so which erupted speaking about it. Well maybe we can't stop bootleggers straight away, but how do you think changes in anything occur? I believe movements don't happen straight away and if just a few people decide to stop buying boots and then their friends also stop buying boots etc, don't you think some of these bootleggers are going to feel it? Maybe not, they make such a profit!!! I don't think buying bootlegs effects sales of albums, but the fact that "outside" people are making money off a band illegally suxs !! But I too, like Caryn, hope I can survive without demos and unrelesed songs and never be tempted to buy a bootleg again, it's hard though...fuckin' hard!! i don't know, i guess I just put myself in the position of the band, poor kids paying pant loads for my music. We should get a petition going to encourage various bands to allow recordings!! C. Hamilton, the Melb BDO sg performance did rock!! Was told that at the Brisbane show, Ben hurled a full botttle of water out in the crowd and hit a girl!! Is that in any review on seth's site? Will have to check! Ok, last bit. Hype! on vid has a clip, at the start, of the Fastbcks singing "Just Say" all dressed up in formal gear!! It rocks! Also didn't someone a while back say they have noticed Chris wears stuff w/90 on it??? In Hype! Kim is also wearing a t-shirt w/90 on it? All flames to personal email please! Fiona ------------------------------ From: "Harris, Court V." <14789harri@bv.com> Subject: Observations Carol: I recorded the interview session of the release of DOTU last year. It was broadcast all over hell, however, so you may have that one. Regarding the Corgan/Cornell issue, I agree with the person who used the English teacher analogy. Who the fuck are we to judge a person's lyrical capabilities?! However, along with the lyrical content discussion, I believe we should be consider Corgan's vocal capabilities not as inferior to Cornell's, but as simply different. Hell, look at Patty Smith. She is a great artist in her own right, and a lot of you would agree, but if I were to judge her on the scales she can belt out, she sucks. Yeah, Corgan is a whiny, narcissistic, belligerent person. That is who he is, and I don't think he would deny it. His music, especially the MCAIS works, reiterates the fact that he is attempting to capture the essence of now, today, youth angst, whatever. If you listen to some of the older stuff and B-sides, they go inside and get away from the trendy shit, esp. on Gish. SG, on the other hand, (in my humble fucking opinion) transcends the constraints of time by focusing on what is inside of each of the band members, and, ironically, most of us. The struggle within. The way we feel from the music SG plays is obviously important to us. That's why we are sitting here posting this shit... Let Corgan be... He is doing his own thing... Caryn: Your observations lately kick ass... YOU RULE... I hope you don't have a deep CC obsession like some of the other patrons. Not healthy... Maybe I'm wrong, though. Chris Cornell owns several vehicles. I have friends who have seen him on the West Seattle Freeway in a blue or black 911 looking Porsche. SO, yes, he drives a Porsche. Wasn't there an interview a while back that indicated he and the author were in a Porsche on the way to see his dogs? Probably RS or Spin... Enough courtez ------------------------------ From: merlin Subject: Chris' Silver Porsche Thanx to Rachel & Rebekah for pointing out that Chris *does* drive a Porsche. :) I'm at a loss though, I don't remember ever reading that. I must've missed something. Silver, huh? That's beautiful. I used to desperately want a silver Jag. If that's ever gonna happen, it's a long way off. I'm happy w/ my Bug though... for now. :-) ~Lorraine ------------------------------ From: Natalie De Rojas Subject: Home to Meet MOM?! it would definitely be MATT!...he is the most innocent looking member...seems quiet too, parents love that...just my two cents! Natalie ~hands are for shaking, no not tying~ SG On Fri, 7 Mar 1997 SJordet@aol.com wrote: > Sorry to those of you whom this doesn't apply to: > > Lisa! I lost your E-Mail address!! I was replying to a message from you and > the stupid AOL (did I mention AOL sucks?) kicked me off! Please get it to me > soon! > > Soundgarden content...uhhh, oh! I have one!! If you were trying to convince > your parents that Soundgarden was made up of good, clean (for the most part) > guys, which one member would you bring home to meet them...? > > I, of course, would go for Ben. Yeah, yeah. I know what most of you have to > say to that, but I don't care. > > Benlover > ------------------------------ From: "Stella Rogers" Subject: Royalties and such Since everyone is talking what exactly what Sg makes money off of, I was wondering....you know how MTV or the shows like Dateline use parts of songs, like the intro or a guitar solo or whatever, do they need to get permission from someone to use those? And if they need to get permission, does Sg make money off those little 30 second bits of songs the TV show will use? This maybe a silly question, but seriously, I've always wondered this. stella ------------------------------ From: ebora87@eelab.newpaltz.edu (Alexander E. Ebora) Subject: Good and Bad News I have both good and bad news to share to you folks. First the good news. I just bought a Green River CD from a used record store. Now the bad news. There are no CD player in sight which I could use to listen to the album in its entirety since I left mine at home and I won't be home till next week or so. But before I left the store, I listened to Green River's Swallow My pride for a few seconds. I thought it was pretty raw and loud. SG's version is easier to listen to I think. Sorry if this is a bad post. I don't have anything to say other than that right now. Never_Named aka Alexander Ebora ------------------------------ From: tonerkin Subject: Boot the habit! OK...here is the deal. I went to my local record store today to look around and what do I come across but a CD boot called Lollapolooza 92. Now the picture alone of a sweaty bare-chested Chris was worth the 20 bucks BUTT since you have all morally challenged me the last few days as I looked at it a vision of straving ungroomed pomeranians swam into my head because of the money I was picking from Chris and Susan's pocket. Soooooooooo I put it back! Now the question is....who of the morally courageous sommsters out there has this boot on tape and would be willing to tape it for me????? toni ------------------------------ From: KAISERVRBL@aol.com Subject: Re: *CD* bootlegs=theft In a message dated 97-03-07 02:30:11 EST, clr@nwlink.com (Caryn Rose) writes: << i'm sorry, this is still ripping off soundgarden because the bootlegger is making money off of *soundgarden's* music. >> I made compilation tapes for about 75 people on the list of SG B-sides & rareties. However, I made no money off of the deal. So am *I* a bootlegger? Lance "All your fears are lies" ------------------------------ From: KAISERVRBL@aol.com Subject: Re: *CD* bootlegs=theft In a message dated 97-03-07 04:16:51 EST, mvint@comp.uark.edu (Orko) writes: << For all of you people who are opponents of bootlegs. I just have this to say... FUck You, Dont buy them, quit bitchin. >> You just gotta love intelligent, articulate people. God bless em. Lance "If I gave him enough rope he'd hang me" Chris Cornell *Angel on Fire* ------------------------------ From: caryn rose Subject: Re: *CD* bootlegs=theft At 01:25 AM 3/8/97 -0500, KAISERVRBL@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 97-03-07 02:30:11 EST, clr@nwlink.com (Caryn Rose) writes: > ><< i'm sorry, this is still ripping off > soundgarden because the bootlegger is making money off of *soundgarden's* > music. >> > >I made compilation tapes for about 75 people on the list of SG B-sides & >rareties. However, I made no money off of the deal. So am *I* a bootlegger? lance, you are being oversensitive. i have defined what a bootlegger is countless times. *tapers* are not bootleggers. and i also said, in the neil young example i gave, that i think that copying stuff that is expensive or impossible to find (like toni's example of making sg tapes for someone in frickin' INDIA) may not be legal but i personally have no ethical qualms about it. however, if sg put together a low-priced two cd compilation of all of that stuff, and THEN you made copies of it for everyone, i'd call you pond scum ;-) what you did took a lot of frickin' work and more power to you for it. - --caryn ------------------------------ From: Deborah Baker Subject: Stamp out bootlegging! Chris needs a new Porsche :-) Caryn wrote: >if soundgarden wanted to prevent bootlegging, the best thing they could do >would be to openly allow taping of their shows. imagine if they had a >taping section, or allowed tape recorders in... A taping section! A moshing section! A section for the girlies who annoyingly shout 'Get your shirt off!' (Yes, other Seth, Real Wild Children does include Crown of Thorns, Louder Than Live and *that* girl).....so where would the rest of us stand?:-)))) While I admit to having bought bootleg cds and videos (most of which are crap so serves me right) the reason I go to any gig is to enjoy the music/atmosphere *while it is happening*. Isn't that what it's really all about? UKDeb (Now a DNA cloners section..*that* I could go for!) ------------------------------ End of somms Digest [Volume 3 Issue 60] ***************************************