From: somms@mit.edu To: somms-digest@mit.edu Subject: Soundgarden Digest, Friday, 27 Sep 1996 Reply-To: somms@mit.edu Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 02:26:58 EDT Sender: saperl The Soundgarden Digest: Friday, 27 Sep 1996 listadmin: saperl@mit.edu list archive: http://www.sgi.net/soundgarden/archive/ TO UNSUBSCRIBE: email saperl@mit.edu Today's Topics: AM I MENTAL? Matts Drumming dotu bashing Re: Searching as an Intro.... Re: Searching for an intro . . . PLEASE ANYONE... 2 cents worth on stuff ATTN: Seattle List Members Re: Article comments... =) RE: 2 cents worth on stuff soundgarden list meeting Sg Re: DOTU does not suck YES, YES, YES....... Re: Moby Remix of "Dusty"-?? Re: One Metric Bevy of Topics: A Lurker Speaks Out! Re: don't like, hate Re: YES, YES, YES....... we have minds of our own, thank you Re: we have minds of our own, thank you Re: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity RE: 2 cents worth on stuff Re: don't like, hate Re: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity Dotu vs. SU vs... Just wondering abt "grunge" Re: Matt's Drumming Re: DOTU does not suck Re: DOTU does not suck Re:THE GARDENERS Re: Dotu vs. SU vs... DOTUS is GREAT check yourself hello Re: Matt's Druming Re: Matt's Druming its all good Re: Just wondering abt "grunge" Re: Matt's Drumming RE: 2 cents worth on stuff Re: Dotu vs. SU vs... fans Albums schmalbums RE: One Metric Bevy of Topics: A Lurker Speaks Out! SOMMS... Re: wooden jesus Re: oh yeah... Re: DOTUS is GREAT DoTU bashing Re: Dotu vs. SU vs... Re: AM I MENTAL? More on Seth's tirade and various replies Re: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity seth's challenge Re: Knight of the soundtable Re: AM I MENTAL? Re: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity like,love Re: AM I MENTAL? Knight of the soundtable wooden jesus Re: wooden jesus oh yeah... Re: wooden jesus More SG Covers Re: wooden jesus Re: seth's challenge RE: hated songs Matt, albums, stuff... hated songs Re: DOTUS is GREAT those who favor DOTU looking for a pedestal... Re: looking for a pedestal... Re: like dying soldiers... Re: wooden jesus Re: old, new fav RE: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity - PLEASE LET ME KNOW ABOUT OLD SHI RE: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity ------------------------------------------------------------ From: mshaw@lib.occ.cccd.edu (Misty Shaw) Subject: AM I MENTAL? You know how you get songs in your head that you can't get rid of? The chorus of "MAILMAN" was in my head all day yesterday: "I know I'm headed for the bottom But I'm riding you all the way I'm riding you all the way" Then for a brief period of time, I had The Cardigans' "CARNIVAL" in my head, which for some strange reason turned into nine inch nails' "REPTILE"! I AM TOTALLY MENTAL! This morning I heard a song and it's lyrics remind me of something: "In the darkest depths of Mordor I met a girl so fair, But Gollum and The Evil One Crept up and slipped away with her." I Know what these lyrics refer to, but do you? The people I know haven't a clue what it means. TWO QUESTIONS: 1)WHAT IS THE NAME OF THE SONG AND WHO IS/ARE THE ARTIST(S)? 2)TO WHAT ARE THESE LYRICS REFERRING TO? Hint: The one with the feather-rune plays drums on the Goodyear blimp. - -- Orange Coast College Costa Mesa California ------------------------------ From: "R. Maney" Subject: Matts Drumming as a drummer for quite a while i feel compelled to contribute my OPINIONS... first of all, you cant listen to some records and make statements like "neil is much better", i mean jesus, have you ever sat down with matt and said ok, play all of the fills in La villa strangiato? yes john henry bonham could hit the SHIT out of a drumhead and yeah keith moon was "wacky" (my own quote), these are ways (IMHO) to talk about drummers and drumming, describe what you hear but DONT extrapolate that to determining whether or not one guy or gal is as technically proficient (of course with some drummers who just SUCK you can do this but..NOT with matt cameron). i read a great interview with neil peart a few years ago where he was asked who some of his favorite contemporary drummers were, he mentioned the guy from live, neil: "he plays exactly what you would want him to" this pretty much sums it up from the mouth of someone we all agree knows about drumming. good drummers play what the songs need and add a little something of their on, some creativity, He also mentioned Matt BTW. Jamie, unfortunately i cant agree with your comment about "only a few drummers" being able to play killer solos, along with the white guys you mentioned there are innumerable black drummers (max roach, art blakey, jack dejohnette, elvin jones) who would quite simply BURY buddy rich god rest his soul. there are plenty of kick ass drummers out there just like guitarists. todd ------------------------------ From: "R. Maney" Subject: dotu bashing put me in the "i agree with seth category"...DOTU is a great album but there is something missing that seth very eloquently described. I feel that SG's next album is going to say a lot about what we are in for. I sense a fork in the road, so to speak. I TRULY BELIEVE that sg can still write stuff to keep me glued to the speakers without being redundant. we are either going to get more of never named or more of tighter and tighter. while i love never named, i gotta go with the latter. given that tighter and tighter was actually written a long time ago , im kind of worried. anyway, DOTU is my favorite release of the year, and practically since the release of SU, so who am i to complain? i have a friend who was a HUGE SG fan until SU, he switched allegiances (haha) and became an even bigger TOOL fan. a certain part of me cannot wait until tool starts putting out "different" or "weaker" stuff. i hope he is prepared.... todd ------------------------------ From: psyche Subject: Re: Searching as an Intro.... >Second question...I think I asked this before, but no one replied...A >friend of mine keeps on telling >me that there is a quick sound clip of an acoustic "Spoonman" in the >movie, "Singles." Is this true? and >if it is, where in the hell does it play?? I rented it a few weeks ago, >but couldn't hear the track, the only acoustic >number was "Seasons."! If I remember correctly, the intro of Spoonman (acoustic? I don't think so) is played right after Matt Dillon & co. watch that video dating thing; after that a "Citizen Dick" flyer is stapled to a wall or something, and that's when the intro is played. It's pretty short and doesn't sound exactly like the album version, so maybe that's why you missed it. Hope that helped! sabrina Hans H. Knauf Hong Kong hhknauf@iohk.com ------------------------------ From: Stardog Subject: Re: Searching for an intro . . . At 00:30 24/09/96 +0000, you wrote: >Question (yet another!): Those of you who have seen SG live, and have seen >them perform Searching with My Good Eye Closed, I was wondering (as someone >who hasn't) - Do they play the intro? Or do they just go straight into the >verse? > >Yes, it's the ducks again . . . > >The Guitarist-2001 > >"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't >exist" - The Usual Suspects > >http://members.aol.com/dczoner - Soundgarden=band of the month! >(not my page...friend's...w/ soon-to-be a little help from me...any >suggestions for a guitar page?) > > > ------------------------------ From: "Kathy Toth" Subject: PLEASE ANYONE... Anyone who could tell me how about to get tickets to the Soundgarden show in NY please privatley e-mail me at Soundgarden59@msn.com!! I just found out i am able to go,,, if it helps I am a memeber of the fanclub Thank you Brian ------------------------------ From: Mercyhurst Prep Library Subject: 2 cents worth on stuff Hi, Listers! Yeah, I've been blabbing away lately and watch for a post later about when I met Sg, which I suggested a few days ago. (Thanks Bonnie, fo picking up on the string--cool story!) I was just noticing w/ today's mail that we'rwe back sort of to something we went thru last year....all this stuff about what album is best and when people got "into" Sg. Does it matter when we got into liking the music and the band? I hope not! That sort of "pulling rank" thing is annoying at best. I've had lots of experience with it....like Toni said earlier, I've also lived and died w/ alot of bands, one being YES. I was, horror of horros, a NEW YES fan...in other words, I got into them w/ the release of 90210 and the advent of Trevor Rabin into the band. Fans were too snotty to see he gave YES a new lease on life and got them thru the 80's, but that's all another story. What I encountered way, way too often was these totally avid, rabid fans who ran around saying stuff like "_I'VE_ liked them since 1970", "Well, _I'VE_ liked them since 1969", and "That's not good enough b/c __I'VE__ liked them since the very beginning." As tho that made them better fans! The point I never got and still don't no matter what the band, does the point at which you discover a band really make you a better or worse fan??? I will readily admit I got into them for real in August 93 after seeing them live for the first time, tho I'd enjoyed BMF a long time before, thanks to my friend Lin who got into them first. But why look down on me b/c of when I got into them? What we should focus on is we all like the same band and it's music, it all means something to eachof us and very likely something very different to each of us. If you're upset about the trendies getting into Sg b/c it's the thing to do, then it's up to you/us to educate them! Like the poor lister who had someone call SG that new Black Hole Sun band....tell them a bit about the history and suggest they try bmf and other albums. If we have newbies on the list, then encourage them to ask questions and NOT feel like they're going to get flamed. This list is about promoting Sg as much as discussing them, I hope! I just had those thoughts as I read my mail this morning and felt like I could share them w/ my family! have a good day and see you all later....deb ------------------------------ From: "Christopher M. Farley" Subject: ATTN: Seattle List Members It looks as if I will be in Seattle sometime in mid to late October on = business. If there are any hot happenings going on please let me know. = Fill me in on where to go(clubs and such) and what to see. I've been to = Seattle twice but did all the usual "touristy" things.(Space Needle, = Pike Place, Cobain's Memorial Service, yada, yada, yada). Thanks in = advance for the info. Chris Farley PS - Hey Caryn, buy you a cup of coffee? ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Article comments... =) From: tonerkin@usa.pipeline.com (Tonerkin) On Sep 24, 1996 21:37:55, 'ShRooMGrLz@aol.com' wrote: >check out this really rad Chris Cornell web page put up by our very own >beloved Caryn. She rules!! >http://www.nwlink.com/~clr/temple.htm I checked out the CC web page..... nice pix but I have one question. What exactly are the duties of "Head" priestess Shroom???? :-) toni ------------------------------ From: "Christopher M. Farley" Subject: RE: 2 cents worth on stuff Minor note: I believe the album was called "91025". I guess you are and old Beverly Hills fan too! Chris - ---------- From: Mercyhurst Prep Library[SMTP:mercylib@erie.net] Sent: Thursday, September 26, 1996 8:25 AM To: somms@MIT.EDU Subject: 2 cents worth on stuff Hi, Listers! Yeah, I've been blabbing away lately and watch for a post later about when I met Sg, which I suggested a few days ago. (Thanks Bonnie, fo picking up on the string--cool story!) I was just noticing w/ today's mail that we'rwe back sort of to something we went thru last year....all this stuff about what album is best and when people got "into" Sg. Does it matter when we got into liking the music and the band? I hope not! That sort of "pulling rank" thing is annoying at best. I've had lots of experience with it....like Toni said earlier, I've also lived and died w/ alot of bands, one being YES. I was, horror of horros, a NEW YES fan...in other words, I got into them w/ the release of 90210 and the advent of Trevor Rabin into the band. Fans were too snotty to see he gave YES a new lease on life and got them thru the 80's, but that's all another story. What I encountered way, way too often was these totally avid, rabid fans who ran around saying stuff like "_I'VE_ liked them since 1970", "Well, _I'VE_ liked them since 1969", and "That's not good enough b/c __I'VE__ liked them since the very beginning." As tho that made them better fans! The point I never got and still don't no matter what the band, does the point at which you discover a band really make you a better or worse fan??? I will readily admit I got into them for real in August 93 after seeing them live for the first time, tho I'd enjoyed BMF a long time before, thanks to my friend Lin who got into them first. But why look down on me b/c of when I got into them? What we should focus on is we all like the same band and it's music, it all means something to eachof us and very likely something very different to each of us. If you're upset about the trendies getting into Sg b/c it's the thing to do, then it's up to you/us to educate them! Like the poor lister who had someone call SG that new Black Hole Sun band....tell them a bit about the history and suggest they try bmf and other albums. If we have newbies on the list, then encourage them to ask questions and NOT feel like they're going to get flamed. This list is about promoting Sg as much as discussing them, I hope! I just had those thoughts as I read my mail this morning and felt like I could share them w/ my family! have a good day and see you all later....deb ------------------------------ From: ROBERT C MONTGOMERY IV Subject: soundgarden list hello from upstate New York, listen, being new to this list I've got a question. If everyone is such a big fan then why do they put down and pick apart the different albums ? I saw SG a few years ago in San Diego, CA opening for GnR. The band totally blew GnR off the stage. Chris commented on the fact that there wasn't a lot of people in the arena yet saying,"those fuckers are gonna miss a good show" and they did. after that I became a big SG fan and have seen them now 13 times. Music is music, every album can't sound the same or they wouldn't aquire new fans and would drop out of existence. So have the listers quit putting the different albums down because it gets old hearing the same shit everyday. Mont Man ------------------------------ From: Mercyhurst Prep Library Subject: meeting Sg Hi again fellow listers! I was trying to start a string when I asked how many people on the list have ever met Sg, either all or one or 2, and a coupke fo people have posted things. So in an effort to get the ball rolling I thought I'd share my experience, even tho it was back in 94. June 94 Sg was to play in Cleveland, which is roughly an hour from where we live, and we is my friend Lin who also co-edits w/ me a zine on Seattle bands. Our first ish came out in April/May 94, and b/c Silver Management had been so helpful we sent them some copies for the office. Our main contact there said we could have passes at the CLeveland show, but of course that was no guarantee we'd even see the band, b/c in her words, "Sg isn't the most sociable band." Understood, no prob, we'd just pass their copies of the zine to them somehow, but instead Susan Fed-Exed the office copies to them on the road. Their tour manager called us the day they got them said they were reading it, liked it and yes, he'd make sure we'd have passes, come over the day before for a chat. Not sure what that was all about, b/c to this day we think he was checking us out to see what sort of people we were. We did not insist we see Sg that day, even tho we saw MAtt floating around; all we did was give DC the stuff we had for the guys--some brownies, Lin had something for CC I had something for Kim....I forget what all we dumped on DC. Next day was the show, and we had to wait for the ticket window to open to get our passes. As it was, even w/out the wait, we were nervous as heck. We'd met alot of bnads before, but none unnerved us as much as Sg--after all, all the bad press you read on them, like how surly and uncooperative they are, we were expecting the worst! DC was cool, and Bill their own head of security was as nice as could be, telling me my photo pass was good for the 2 openers as well, so yeah, I got pix also of 11 and Tad. Both Bill and DC said the same thing--passes didn't mean we'd even see them, as DC said, he always left after show stuff entirely up to the band, and we said we understood, whatever happened was cool w/ us. Kick ass show even tho it was raining. Absolutely awesome sound, and the setting was so cool for Sg. Nautica in Cleveland has this huge upright old train yard crane that's flood lighted, and CC seemed awestruck by it. I've never heard the band sound so good--anyone have an audio of that show--6/24/94? After the show, we waited were DC said to and even tho there were other people w/ passes, we were the only 2 he took back w/ him. Backstage there were maybe a few radio winners and some people who maybe knew someone who did them a favor, whatever. We sat nervously and watched DC take them in to this trailer/building and then bring them right back out. I said to Lin it was probably good we'd left our photos and junk in the car b/c of the rain--yeah we were soaked--AND b/c it looked like all we'd manage was hi, nice to meet you, good show, bye. Finally DC came for us, took us in, introed us to the guys....and left! We were stunned! Kim was the one who "greeted" us b/c he was closest to the door, and sort of guarding the doorway to this room CC was in, lounging on a sofa, talking on the phone. As sson as DC left, Kim goes "______ has a Girard PA address, and I get lots of neat stuff from Girard PA." Oh, crap, I was found out--I'd been sending him cards and MArvin stuff for over a year, so I confessed and darned if he didn't insist on calling me Debbie, which I dislike, but I wasn't going to correct him. For a while he continued to guard the door, then he sat in the chair just inside the door--CC still on the phone and watching us w/ Kim--and began to look thru the NY Times, so we started talking about OJ Simpson and spouse abuse and date rape and stuff. Lin had a few things to ask CC so he waved her over to the sofa, where he was STILL on the phone, and being so cute so we figure it was Peter he was talking to, not his stock broker like Matt kept saying, and he'd talk to her or they'd write notes back and forth. Kim kept saying how hot it was inside so he got up again at some point and we were both once again bugging him. This was so cool, so allow me to go into detail. We asked if we could have guitar picks, and he had 2 in his pocket, but he said he wanted to trade for them...he wanted Lin's one necklace which was a metal dancing man figure w/ sort of a crucifix head--I'd given it to her for Xmas a year or so before and she wore it all the time. She said yes, he could have it and I had to get it untangled from her hair. CC was watching everything, and he started yelling--yes, still on the phone--"No, No, don't do it!!!! Don't do it!! Just give them the picks fer chrissake!!!" The trade was made, then Kim goes "You don't really have to do this, I just wanted to see if you would." and to me he goes "aren't you offended she'd give away a gift you gave to her?" My dimwitted response was "I don't mind, as long as it's for you." So, Kimster has Lin's necklace to this day! He went outside and we ended up chatting W/ Matt and his girlfriend w/ Ben looking on curiously but not too approachable, and yes, CC was still on the phone but still adding comments to the proceedings. We lost all track of time and we wanted to make a good impression so we decided after....I dunno, 45 minutes?....that maybe we should say goodbye and thank DC. Outside we found Kim talking to someone and I wanted to make sure to say goodbye to him, so we waited patiently, but he soon dragged us into the conversation and then began to just talk to us. Let's put it this way...goodbye to Kim took another 20 minutes...and Lin asked to touch his beard, which he allowed her to do. Why didn't I? I dunno, too floored by the man I guess. I was busy admiring his skin color and long eye lashes! We found DC and thanked him profusely and off we went, on Cloud 9 for certain! 3 days later Silver Management called to offer us interviews w/ 3 of their lesser bands....and we still think it was b/c someone turned in a good report on us. We were calm, sane and treated them like normal people and that's the way to go, we've found. OK, thanks for reading my lengthy tale. It was truly an amazing encounter. Kim was so awesome and so friendly...they were all really pleasant! That's one reason I read stuff in certain rags w/ a grain of salt, like w/ CC swearing every other word. We've encountered him twice, and he's just a quiet, shy guy. Even mom Karen loves to say how totally different his stage personna is to him in real life, and she's right! Ok, listers....who's next? I bet w/ 600+ of us we have lots of encounters to talk about! I'll give your email a rest now....ciao....deb ------------------------------ From: new wave biscuit Subject: Re: DOTU does not suck On Wed, 25 Sep 1996, mcinturff, dylan wrote: > SOMMS people- > I just wanted to make a statement in reference to all the DOTU > bashing I've heard lately. Frankly, I like it a whole lot no matter > what anyone else thinks. Seth, don't kick me off the list for this, > but you CANNOT expect a band to put out the same album again and agin > and again. I get this from people who used to like Pearl Jam and are > upset that No Code isn't exactly like Ten. Get the fuck over it! I > am a musician, and although I like songs that myself and members of my > band have written in the past, I'm also REALLY GLAD that we write > songs that are different now. I'm sure SG feels the same way. And I > think everyone on the list should turn up Ty Cobb really loud and > sing along, and then talk about how weak it is. Hard headed, fuck > you all... > Dylan > Again. I agree. In fact, I find this whole trend of DotU bashing quite interesting. You see, before a certian self-superior moron called Michael Bortnik arrived with his "I like better bands than you do, so there!!" attitude and delusions of competence, everybody claimed to *like* DotU. Everybody was saying how it was such a cool album, but ever since he arrived and started slating people who got into SG through Superunkown and basically criticizing anybody who liked new SG, you've all suddenly changed your opinions and started saying how much DotU sucks. Its as if you're trying to impress the guy and prove to him that you're not as "mainstream" as he's trying to make out, or something. So he really has gotten to you all, hasn't he? One silly little idiot with his head firmly planted in his behind comes on this list, starts spewing a load of random generalisations and sweeping staements about people on here based on very insubstantial facts and the next thing you know, you're all changing your opinions to suit him. That really is very, very sad and truly pathetic. You've all said that you've not taken any of his inane ramblings to heart, but here you are criticizing new SG when, only five minutes ago you liked it!! Are you *scared* of him or something!? As I said yesterday, I like new SG, I like old SG as well. I'm not going to go on a "I prefer the stuff they did before the were even born, which means I'm a proper fan" trip, because its childish and stupid. Again, as I said yesterday, if you all hate DotU so much, then don't listen to it. Nobody's forcing you to and when the album after that comes out, why not criticize that as well!? After all, its bound to suck, isn't it, 'cos it'll be new, and if you dare admit you like it, then that makes you mainstream!! Er.. yeah. YOu've all played straight into that idiot's hands. I'm sure he's probably laughing right now. It must be great being able to influence so many people's opinions in such a short space of time. I don't know, I really thought you were all better than this. Maybe I was wrong. - -me, disappointed that so-called Soundgarden fans are behaving in such an infantile manner. ------------------------------ Subject: YES, YES, YES....... From: jsimpson@mail03.mitre.org (Jamesetta Simpson) Am I the only one who talks back to the recorded voice that comes on when you are on hold. The lady from TicketMaster is just about to drive me crazy. She values me as a customer sure and Chris can write or sing. Never mind I got thought.. Toni - Eliza..... Pack your bags ladies we have tickets for Nov. 20th for "SOUNDGARDEN" The DC chapter of SOMMSfest 96' is now official. Greg and other member going to the DC show please e-mail if you want to link up. Greg I do believe we should have a tail gate.. Damn, I have waited for years to see SG, missed them so many times....now three times in one month. Life is good!!!! Jamie (Crazy, Wild, and Very Happy Village Idiot) 43 days until Chicago SOMMsfest 96' 54 days until DC SOMMsfest 96' 85 days until my Stacy is here Yes life is very good... ------------------------------ From: new wave biscuit Subject: Re: Moby Remix of "Dusty"-?? On Wed, 25 Sep 1996, S. Mohanty wrote: > I heard that Moby will be remixing Dusty as a b-side for the new Blow > Up the Outside World single. Isn't this kind of stupid though?? Why is > Moby remixing a Soundgarden song and more importantly an _acoustic_ > rock song at that? The remix that he did of Metallica's Until It Sleeps > was really fucked up and now he's going to screw up one of my favorites > on the new SG album. > > I mean sure Moby can do some cool remixes, such as 1979 by the Smashing > Pumpkins, but that song has a lot of techno vibes in it and Dusty IS > NOT supposed to be a techo song! I have to agree. He could've picked a more suitable song to remix. By taking an acoustic song and remixing it like that, its as if he's deliberately trying to ruin it and take the piss. - -me ------------------------------ From: new wave biscuit Subject: Re: One Metric Bevy of Topics: A Lurker Speaks Out! On Wed, 25 Sep 1996, chris wrote: > On the other hand, TYPING while stoned... > > Just for the record, listening to SG not stoned is also cool. In fact, > doing most things not stoned is also cool. Please don't flame me, I'm not > calling anyone a junkie or anything (you damn junk junkies on junk!), but > drugs don't add anything you can't get by having an open mind and an active > imagination (or by standing up, looking at the ceiling, and spinning around > really really fast). *yawn!* Don't bother preaching to me, kid. I really couldn't care for your opinions. I wouldn't tell you how to live your life, so don't tell me how to live mine. Thank you. > > "Dope - you are what you smoke.": Frank Zappa Oh, what a statement!! - -me ------------------------------ From: new wave biscuit Subject: Re: don't like, hate On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, Greg Dunbar wrote: > Fopp : Kingdom Of Come Kingdom of COme!? It's one of my favourite SG songs!! > Superunknown : Kickstand Kickstand is damn cool as well, what's going on!? :) > Down On The Upside : Rhinosaur I didn't like that song at first, but its grown on me now... - -me ------------------------------ From: Greg Bensimon Subject: Re: YES, YES, YES....... On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, Jamesetta Simpson wrote: > The DC chapter of SOMMSfest 96' is now official. > > Greg and other member going to the DC show please e-mail if you want to > link up. Greg I do believe we should have a tail gate.. I'm there Jamie. I've got the cooler in the back of my truck. I guess someone else needs to supply the hibachi. I'm already counting down the days... Greg ------------------------------ From: caryn rose Subject: we have minds of our own, thank you At 03:22 PM 9/26/96 +0100, new wave biscuit wrote: >Again. I agree. In fact, I find this whole trend of DotU bashing quite >interesting. You see, before a certian self-superior moron called >Michael Bortnik arrived with his "I like better bands than you do, so >there!!" attitude and delusions of competence, everybody claimed to >*like* DotU. this is untrue. i know for a fact that many people on this list have had their problems with DotU, and we discussed them pretty detailed if i recall. you can like something and still acknowledge its limitations. > Everybody was saying how it was such a cool album, but ever >since he arrived and started slating people who got into SG through >Superunkown and basically criticizing anybody who liked new SG, you've >all suddenly changed your opinions and started saying how much DotU >sucks. Its as if you're trying to impress the guy and prove to him that >you're not as "mainstream" as he's trying to make out, or something. So >he really has gotten to you all, hasn't he? EXCUSE ME????? who are you to tell any of us why we are doing something? i think that the people who were disappointed by DotU kept quiet because they seemed be overshadowed by the people who loved it. also, it is hard to say that you don't like the latest album by your favorite band --well, it is to some people. i think it is extremely unfair to criticize all 600+ of us on this list for this... i hardly think that this is our motivation. we were too busy thinking up interesting mailing lists to sign mr. bornick up for. ;-) > As I said yesterday, I like new SG, I like old SG as well. I'm >not going to go on a "I prefer the stuff they did before the were even >born, which means I'm a proper fan" trip, because its childish and stupid. >Again, as I said yesterday, if you all hate DotU so much, then don't >listen to it. Nobody's forcing you to and when the album after that >comes out, why not criticize that as well!? After all, its bound to >suck, isn't it, 'cos it'll be new, and if you dare admit you like it, >then that makes you mainstream!! Er.. yeah. i think you h ave missed the point. there have been quite eloquent discussions of WHY people here do not like DotU, from people like Seth and Justin (blind dog). if you bothered to take the time to actually READ what they said, there is no way you could come to the conclusion that these intelligent soundgarden fans were 'changing their mind' because some troll jumps on the list and starts flaming us. gimme a break. - --caryn ------------------------------ From: new wave biscuit Subject: Re: we have minds of our own, thank you On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, caryn rose wrote: > i think you h ave missed the point. there have been quite eloquent > discussions of WHY people here do not like DotU, from people like Seth and > Justin (blind dog). if you bothered to take the time to actually READ what > they said, there is no way you could come to the conclusion that these > intelligent soundgarden fans were 'changing their mind' because some troll > jumps on the list and starts flaming us. I really thought you would've known that, by that post, I was referring to those who were criticizing the album, not all 600+ members of this list. Why would I criticize "everybody" when it wasn't "everybody" who made such comments? I'm sorry I didn't make that more obvious but... I didn't really think that I needed to. I apologize if I sounded a bit harsh, but as someone who likes ALL their albums equally for what they are (although I do prefer some to others) I got a bit annoyed seeing all these people slating the new album. And its all everybody ever seems to do these days anyway - regardless of the band. Whenever a new band comes out, all their fans jump on the "their new stuff sucks... their old stuff is better... and I'm a bigger fan 'cos I've been into 'em since they were foetuses, so there!!" bandwagon. I apologise for those of whom this was not so, and I was *not* criticizing the whole list, so calm down. Just for the record, my favourite album they've done is "Louder Than Love". > gimme a break I'll give you two if you like... - -me ------------------------------ From: Sachin Trivedi Subject: Re: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity Hey, I was just wondering about whatexactly happened with the other shirts. Nothingman took the money and ran? that's funny because i did get my shirt. Am I the only one? It's actually a pretty cool shirt and I plan on wearing it to the Brandeis show. Later Sachin On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, seth wrote: > > This message is being sent to both the regular list and the digest > list, because I know people don't always keep up with the digest and > this is important enough that everyone should see it right away. > > The opportunity has arisen for you to purchase SOMMS mailing list > t-shirts once again. This time, the shirts will be produced by Dena > (GeekGirl@aol.com) and will be ready *before* the US tour begins. THE > DEADLINE FOR EXPRESSING INTEREST IN PURCHASING SHIRTS OR HATS IS > SEPTEMBER 27. Direct all responses to GEEKGIRL@AOL.COM. > > No, we didn't vote on this. If you don't want a shirt, don't order > one, it's as simple as that. The reason I'm backing Dena on this is > that she offered to do it, sent me a sample and the shirt is *exactly* > how the one that Nothingdick was producing was supposed to look > (although these shirts are white, not off-white). They look really > professional. She and I have talked at length about this and I'm > convinced she will not take our money and run. > > If you want to see the shirt design, go to the private mailing list > part of the Web page, at http://www.sgi.net/soundgarden/list/shirt/, > and take a look. The "somms@mit.edu" logo at the top of the page is > what appears on the front of the shirt where a pocket would normally > be, and the fork logo (with brighter text) will be on the back of the > shirt. > ------------------------------ From: Mercyhurst Prep Library Subject: RE: 2 cents worth on stuff At 09:46 AM 9/26/96 -0400, you wrote: >Minor note: I believe the album was called "91025". I guess you are and old Beverly Hills fan too! > >Chris > > Oops, gawd, my mistake! I was typing real fast and didn't catch it! No, I hate BH90210! Yes, 90125! Forgive me! ------------------------------ From: "Greg Dunbar" Subject: Re: don't like, hate Interesting thread this. I thought instead of just singling out one or two I would say what I think is the worst (which is a pretty hard choice) from each album. Screaming Life : Entering Fopp : Kingdom Of Come Ultramega OK : One Minute Of Silence (bit of a cop-out!) or Circle Of Power Louder Than Love : Loud Love itself Badmotorfinger : Searching With My Good Eye Closed (I'll probably get bagged for this but it is the only song that I can ever skip of BMF) Superunknown : Kickstand Down On The Upside : Rhinosaur B-Sides : Jerry Garcia's Finger (I bought the Pretty Noose #2 single for this song and it is the only thing by Soundgarden that I would consider to be a waste of money) Anyhow, any of those things (except JGF) are superior to anything that most bands of done, so you can't take these comments to hard. - ------------------------------------------------------------- "Loosely or tightly Everything Fits Even The Wrist On Your Arm" Applebite - Soundgarden - -------------------------------------------------------------- GD - -------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ From: Mercyhurst Prep Library Subject: Re: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity At 11:52 AM 9/26/96 -0400, you wrote: > > >Hey, > > I was just wondering about whatexactly happened with the other >shirts. Nothingman took the money and ran? that's funny because i did >get my shirt. Am I the only one? It's actually a pretty cool shirt and >I plan on wearing it to the Brandeis show. Later > >Sachin > > Hey, I got mine too, and I've been too busy to read the digests yet, from over the summer when I was off the list. Can anyone clue us, maybe privately, as to what all did go on....briefly too. I was just bummed b/c the words are so hard to read. Sorry, don't want another shirt, not white. I really dislike white shirts!!!! But that's just me! tally-ho! deb ------------------------------ From: ADDC Subject: Dotu vs. SU vs... Extremely interesting thread we got going here. Let me enter this and spew out some of my thoughts. Seth, I have to say..it does take a certain amount of..I dunno..balls to say what you said about DOTU considering your position. Do I agree? Well, yes and no. I feel the same way about Superunknown as the way you feel about Badmotorfinger. I somewhat agree that DOTU is, perhaps, not as *epic?* as you were probably expecting it to be but when I say that, I am comparing it to Superunknown and not BadMotorfinger. I do feel that DOTU is extremely better than BMF. Of course there are some really great songs on BMF but I feel that, as one entire package, it is not as great as Dotu. But DOTU is by in no means perfect. Look at Superunknown for a sec. Practically every song grabs me and puts me in a trance. I *feel* when I listen to SU. But with DOTU, there are some songs that simply don't do it for me. So Seth, would you catagorize yourself as being "disappointed" with DOTU? What do you think about the future of SG? Man am I rambling or what..better stop. Thanks for reading. Vincent Varkey UT-Dallas ------------------------------ From: Mark Miller Subject: Just wondering abt "grunge" Does everyone think grunge is dead? I hate to use that word for more reasons than I have the time to address but I think everyone knows what I mean. It seems my big 3 (SG, SP, PJ) have gone more straight ahead rock n roll. Of course I have never really considered PJ to be grunge but that is starting a vicious circle with the previous sentence. Ah, whatever nevermind I guess it is too hard of a question to answer. Anyway it seems like most of the people on the list like Badmotorfinger the best. Have we ever compiled the data? Mark Im the man and you're the man and he's the man as well so you can point the f**kin finger up your ass! --Tool ------------------------------ From: Paul_Faraguna@dbna.com (Paul Faraguna) Subject: Re: Matt's Drumming I know I'm gonna get hammered for this, but here goes anyway. Matt is an excellent drummer. He's probably a perfect fit for SG. But trying to make him out to be the greatest just doesn't fly. He doesn't beat the manic aggression and energy of Keith Moon or John Bonham, and he doesn't have the technical ability of Neil Peart, Carl Palmer, or Bill Bruford. Again, that doesn't mean that he's not perfect for SG. Without him they wouldn't be the band that we all love. Really great bands are always more than the sum of their parts. Every once in a while, the Gods of Rock put together a group of people that, individually might not make it, but when they are together....BANG! It just clicks. SG are what they are. They're great and I wouldn't change a thing. Paul ------------------------------ Subject: Re: DOTU does not suck From: seth > Again. I agree. In fact, I find this whole trend of DotU bashing quite > interesting. You see, before a certian self-superior moron called > Michael Bortnik arrived with his "I like better bands than you do, so > there!!" attitude and delusions of competence, everybody claimed to > *like* DotU. Everybody was saying how it was such a cool album, but ever > since he arrived and started slating people who got into SG through > Superunkown and basically criticizing anybody who liked new SG, you've > all suddenly changed your opinions and started saying how much DotU > sucks. Its as if you're trying to impress the guy and prove to him that > you're not as "mainstream" as he's trying to make out, or something. So > he really has gotten to you all, hasn't he? There are lines in life, and you are coming extremely close to crossing one right there. Why don't you tell me where I said "I like DOTU"? Maybe 6 people out of 625 say "I think I like Badmotorfinger better than DOTU" and all of a sudden you decide we've come to this conclusion because of Michael Bortnik? It is very, very difficult to essentially walk into a room filled with 600+ diehard Soundgarden fans and announce that you don't like the new album. I'm still waiting to hear something intelligent from you, perhaps a message that tells us *why* you like DOTU, how you think it compares to the other records. All I've seen so far from you is a blind love for anything and everything Soundgarden. Wake up and grow an opinion. And don't purport to have the *slightest* idea how I form mine. seth ------------------------------ From: dbradsh@unity.ncsu.edu Subject: Re: DOTU does not suck how long have you been on this list? were you here when DOTU was first released? do you happen to note then that many of us were not as enamored with DOTU as others? maybe you should check back thru the old digests to the time when the album was released may 14 for the vinyl and may 21 for the CD i believe...maybe then you will see that you are talking out of turn... and while i am here...why attack people for disliking songs that you like? it is all subjective..everything in music is subjective...in other words my opinion and your opinion are going to vary greatly and as fellow fans we should respect others opinions, listen to those opinions and god forbid learn something from them rather than disecting them... DD ******************************************************************************** Dee Dee Bradshaw-Autry "Be careful with me...I am fragile. Im a bitch babe...and Im on fire" Garbage http://www.infochase.com/ent/deedee/index.html "The shortest distance between two points may be a straight line, but the longest distance between them is `life'." SubG "Sleep tight for me...I'm gone..." Sound Garden ******************************************************************************** ------------------------------ From: homer@cambridge.scr.slb.com (Natalie Homer) Subject: Re:THE GARDENERS This is in response to Monnica Lewis. We get the same problem over here in Britain it's not just people from Indiana.In about 1992 there was the Nirvana EXPLOSION then swiftly followed(but much less commercialised,was the arrival of Pearl Jam to these shores) But after all of the fuss had died down (well a few years down the line anyway) all the *trendies* were bored and looking for something else to like. Out came the Indie Britpop shit and it's been going on for a while now... And then there's the Punk explosion(Re-explosion) I'm not sure where they're heading off to now(the trendies that is) .See I love SDGN for their music not because everyone else does,nor because noone else does (if you see what I mean). Loads of a bands success depends on airplay,MTV,etc so once something else takes the fancy of whoever RULES THE AIRWAVES (quick Ramones pun )then the nation is subjected an amazingly starts to like it . Thats what I reckon anyway. **************************************************************************** Natalie Homer Tel: +44 (0)1223 325369 Schlumberger Cambridge Research Ltd. Fax: +44 (0)1223 467004 High Cross Email: homer@cam ------------------------------ From: caryn rose Subject: Re: Dotu vs. SU vs... On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, ADDC wrote: > Extremely interesting thread we got going here. Let me enter this and > spew out some of my thoughts. Seth, I have to say..it does take a certain > amount of..I dunno..balls to say what you said about DOTU considering > your position. his "position"??? this is not a flame... but i do NOT understand for one minute why the fact that he runs a sg mailing list and a kick ass sg web site means that he must unquestionably love EVERYTHING the band puts out. in fact, I would argue that the fact that he doesn't like DotU, and isn't afraid to say so, means he REALLY loves the band. do soundgarden want their fans to swallow everything they do unquestionably? absolutely not. i am quite sure that the band really, truely value the fact that we have active, intelligent, informed, emotional debate about their music and them as a band on this list. i mean -- kim's a damn philosophy major! you think he wouldn't value a good argument when he saw it??? seth, more power to you for not liking DotU. more power to you for standing up for what you think and believe and feel. like any sg fan on this list, i would like to affirm your right to say whatever you damn well please about the band. - --caryn a little disappointed that the 'what would YOU do' shirt design didn't make it this time around ;-) ------------------------------ Subject: DOTUS is GREAT From: "Shawn David Kennedy" I am not going to say that all of you out there are wrong in your choosing Badmotorfinger or any other SG album as your favorite album. I mean, you like what you like. But, I think that 'Down' is better just because it has songs for every mood. BMF just kicks you in the face, and Some days I like that better. I don't really know what I'm trying to say, except that I think everything that the band has done is incredible, and I respect the fact that the band is trying new things. FAVORITE SG SONG= Rusty Cage, Jesus Christ Pose, or Let Me Drown LEAST FAVORITE= New Damage, or Fresh Deadly Roses Favorite Line= I'm lucks last match struck, in the pouring down wind..." or "Hard headed Fuck you all" Anyone out there agree with me that Nazi Driver just rocks? ------------------------------ From: mshaw@lib.occ.cccd.edu (Misty Shaw) Subject: check yourself THIS IS WHAT "Chris" POSTED RECENTLY: "Rap music: Wouldn't wish death or racism or being called a racist on anyone, but the words "rap" and "music" should never be used together - it's an oxymoron like "jumbo shrimp" or "military intelligence." This is not to say rap isn't a valid art form, there's just nothing "musical" about most of it, at least most that I've heard - but I should check out the new Dogg Pound before I say anything, huh?" Hey, man, not all rap music is bad. What you see on television is COMMERCIAL rap music. I am very pissed at MTV and other media that exploit or encourage what is not the true spirit of rap. In the past few days, SOMMS members made references to the commercialized rappers Snoop Doggy Dogg and Tupac. THEY'RE FUCKING GANGSTA RAPPERS!! Rap can bevery musical--for example, A Tribe Called Quest, The Roots, and Digable Planets use live music in place of samples sometimes. De La Soul is totally against violence, drugs, and the exploitation of women. It saddens me when I hear commericial urban radio stations and I hear how the Notorious B.I.G. brags about his money and his bitches. If you were listening in the mid-to-late 8o's, a lot of rap music was about the upliftment of people, philosophies(check out KRS-One/Boogie Down Productions), or just plain fun. I see nothing fun in wanting to shoot someone down. I feel very defensive right now because I really loved the 80's rap era. Even though I am defensive of rap , I hardly listen to any of it in this decade because most of it doesn't appeal to me anymore. To me the "Art" of it is lost somewhere. Maybe eventually it will resurface. RoseeMisst p.s. I used to hate all rock music, classify it under heavy metal, called it devil music, etc.--I gave rock music a chance many years ago, and now I absolutely love it. That says something about letting our predjudices go. - -- Orange Coast College Costa Mesa California ------------------------------ Subject: hello From: "Shawn David Kennedy" Is this thing working, my computer says that it crashed ------------------------------ From: Joe Cennamo Subject: Re: Matt's Druming On Wed, 25 Sep 1996, Jamesetta Simpson wrote: > > I think that I mentioned in a earlier post that I was a drummer, I think > >thought that Matt was the best drumer I had ever heard. > >I was wondering if there were any other members on the list who felt the > >same way about Matt. > > > >joec > > There has only been one other drummer who has held my attention, only one > other who I consider a better drummer than Matt. And today is the > anniversary of his death. He die after consuming 40 shots of vodka at the > home of the lead guitarist for the band he was in. Do you know who it was? > > Jamie > (Village Idiot) > Not sure, I am guessing Keith Moon from the Who, not sure though. joec ------------------------------ From: Joe Cennamo Subject: Re: Matt's Druming I think Matt sound's a little like Mitch Mitchell. But there techniqes are completly differenton alot of songs. joec ------------------------------ Subject: its all good From: "Shawn David Kennedy" I think we all have our own favorite Soundgarden albums, and when it comes down to it, all of them are pretty damn good. To say that 'Down' is weak, though, is grossly inaccurate. It is very experimental and captures the band in a very creative stage in their careers. Badmotorfinger is great, and really kicks you in the face, but I like 'Down' just as much. There are songs on it that fit any mood. Anyway, at least give it a chance. FAVORITE SG SONG: Rusty Cage, Jesus Christ Pose, or Let Me Drown LEAST FAVORITE SONG: New Damage, or Fresh Deadly Roses FAVORITE LYRIC: I'm luck's last match struck in the pouring down wind... OR: Hard headed, fuck you all Nazi Driver is a kick ass song ------------------------------ From: Joe Cennamo Subject: Re: Just wondering abt "grunge" On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, Mark Miller wrote: > Does everyone think grunge is dead? I hate to use that word for > more reasons than I have the time to address but I think everyone knows > what I mean. It seems my big 3 (SG, SP, PJ) have gone more straight ahead > rock n roll. Of course I have never really considered PJ to be grunge but > that is starting a vicious circle with the previous sentence. Ah, > whatever nevermind I guess it is too hard of a question to answer. > Anyway it seems like most of the people on the list like > Badmotorfinger the best. Have we ever compiled the data? > Mark > Im the man and you're the man and he's the man as well so you can point > the f**kin finger up your ass! --Tool > Grunge died the day it became trendy to be grunge. joec ------------------------------ From: Joe Cennamo Subject: Re: Matt's Drumming On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, Paul Faraguna wrote: > > I know I'm gonna get hammered for this, but here goes anyway. > > Matt is an excellent drummer. He's probably a perfect fit for SG. But > trying to make him out to be the greatest just doesn't fly. He doesn't > beat the manic aggression and energy of Keith Moon or John Bonham, and > he doesn't have the technical ability of Neil Peart, Carl Palmer, or > Bill Bruford. Again, that doesn't mean that he's not perfect for SG. > Without him they wouldn't be the band that we all love. Really great > bands are always more than the sum of their parts. Every once in a > while, the Gods of Rock put together a group of people that, > individually might not make it, but when they are together....BANG! > It just clicks. SG are what they are. They're great and I wouldn't > change a thing. > > Paul i couldn't agree more joec ------------------------------ From: Monnica Lewis Subject: RE: 2 cents worth on stuff Hi, it's me. I don't want to start an ugly debate about it or anything because we all have our own feelings and opinions about things but I just wanted to reply. Anyway, I feel really negative about the people I consider "trendies" because they are so insincere. New fans are fine the more the merrier. But, it's like around here, we have all these people who act like they are this "progressive", ..... I don't know. It's like they are putting on aires. Since Nirvanna everything "Seattle" has become an obsession and people just absolutely copy the surface, or outward image of this whole little "scene" But deep down in side, the people who were just big rednecks before all this still have the same rotten attitudes. Maybe where you live, this isn't the case. You're lucky :-) So it's like, where I come from and the people I encounter on a daily basis, that's just my feeling. I'm not trying to alienate new fans or anything. And I'm not even going to try to pretend that I know everything there is to know about SG because that wouldn't be true - - I'm kinda new to the list myself. my opinion Monnica ---------- From: Mercyhurst Prep Library To: somms Subject: 2 cents worth on stuff Date: Thursday, September 26, 1996 8:25AM If you're upset about the trendies getting into Sg b/c it's the thing to do, then it's up to you/us to educate them! Like the poor lister who had someone call SG that new Black Hole Sun band....tell them a bit about the history and suggest they try bmf and other albums. If we have newbies on the list, then encourage them to ask questions and NOT feel like they're going to get flamed. This list is about promoting Sg as much as discussing them, I hope! I just had those thoughts as I read my mail this morning and felt like I could share them w/ my family! have a good day and see you all later....deb ------------------------------ From: Monnica Lewis Subject: Re: Dotu vs. SU vs... I agree. Pretending you like something just because a certain person or group of people created it is really insincere. I LIKE DotU but I LOVED a lot of their previous stuff. I thought DotU was a little anti-climatic. ---------- From: caryn rose To: ADDC Cc: somms Subject: Re: Dotu vs. SU vs... Date: Thursday, September 26, 1996 10:54AM On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, ADDC wrote: > Extremely interesting thread we got going here. Let me enter this and > spew out some of my thoughts. Seth, I have to say..it does take a certain > amount of..I dunno..balls to say what you said about DOTU considering > your position. in fact, I would argue that the fact that he doesn't like DotU, and isn't afraid to say so, means he REALLY loves the band. do soundgarden want their fans to swallow everything they do unquestionably? absolutely not. i am quite sure that the band really, truely value the fact that we have active, intelligent, informed, emotional debate about their music and them as a band on this list. i mean -- kim's a damn philosophy major! you think he wouldn't value a good argument when he saw it??? ------------------------------ Subject: fans From: "Shawn David Kennedy" I think that Soundgarden's popularity is still high, but to me, it seems like it is not what it was after Superunknown. This is not really a bad thing, because it makes it easier to tell who the "real" fans are. There is nothing worse than going to a concert packed with people who just think it is cool to be there, and aren't really into the band. You can tell who these people are at shows: They are the ones who scream the one or two songs that are on MTV are played. I just enjoy a show a lot more when the whole crowd and the band are into it. This is not to say that I am condemning new fans of Soundgarden. Actually, I think it is good that people are waking up and getting into them, but I just wish people liked them for the right reasons. ------------------------------ From: "Mo" Subject: Albums schmalbums I for one, love all soundgarden stuff. In fact, I cannot think of any other CDs to buy except Soundgarden ones. When I've bought Temple of The Dog, it'll be all over. My collection will be complete (besides singles and stuff). I will have no more CDs to buy until they come up with a new album. In my opinion everything from Ultramega OK to DOTU totally rocks and there is no band better in the whole wide world. I say f**k the rest, SG are the best. Anyhow... that's just my opinion... and Jerry Garcia's Finger is not a waste of money! It rules no end! I listen to JGF just as much as I listen to JCP.... um... maybe I'm going a bit overboard there... But it's a cool instrumentel and let nobody tell you it's not! Mo. =="Sleep tight for me, I'm gone..."== (Tighter and Tighter - Chris Cornell) http://indigo.ie/~majoc/ majoc@indigo.ie ------------------------------ From: Carolyn Hanel Subject: RE: One Metric Bevy of Topics: A Lurker Speaks Out! Chris - without going into too much detail, your post was excellent (in = my humble opinion, of course). So many views expressed so = well..............very worthy of winning SEVERAL "quote of the week" = prizes!=20 (I still haven't got around to sending Seth the old best quotes I kept = from around August-October last year - sorry). Chris wrote: >>Best lyric: "I had a dog / he was a mix / he loved me like a god / though I was just = a kid" - this perfectly captures looking back on childhood... it's not as showy or as dark as y'all's picks, but it grabs me by the back of the = neck, slaps me in Captain America Underoos and flings me back to the '70s. >>The Progression of a band: It can sometimes feel like a betrayal when a band matures or redefines their sound... it's kind of like tuning in "ER" one week to find out = that it's all the same actors and characters but now they're doing "Full = House." ("Little Michelle is gagging on a chicken bone! I need 10ccs of sodium pentathol on an IV push and prep for a peritoneal lavage! Stat!")=20 Ha ha! Chris, I'm still stuck at home very sick [sob sob], but reading = this post has got me laughing at last......thank you! :-) >>Just for the record, listening to SG not stoned is also cool. In = fact, doing most things not stoned is also cool. Please don't flame me, I'm = not calling anyone a junkie or anything (you damn junk junkies on junk!), = but drugs don't add anything you can't get by having an open mind and an = active imagination (or by standing up, looking at the ceiling, and spinning = around really really fast). And I couldn't agree more. =20 [my hat goes off to you] Bye, Carolyn the Monastic Fleshwound I would kill for a good night's sleep....Therapy? ------------------------------ From: "Luck's Last Match" Subject: SOMMS... My luck is amazing. I went to the local record store today despues de mi trabajo sin dinero...sorry, after my volunteer thingy, and i was just going to look through the local artists to see if there were any used cd's i wanted. Well, while in the store, i decided i'd make absolutely sure they had no SG that i didn't have. I was right they didn't. But they did have SOMMS! So now i have another copy of somms, and it only cost me $9.53 (American) including tax! Beat that! And to add to that, as soon as I walked out of the store, the bus pulled up to the bus stop! I love my luck. Tengo mucho suerte hoy. estoy alegre! Well, i guess that's all. laters. "Stand up and everyone will see your holiness" -Soundgarden. ------------------------------ From: Cornell Subject: Re: wooden jesus I think the 20% thing is just kind of an ironic commentary on society and relgion in the modern world.... Everyone cuts deals for what they want...CC's looking for redemption through his blind faith, so he offers "20% of [his] future sin" Gregg On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, alexander ebora wrote: > > i was pondering on what the lyrics of wooden jesus by TOTD meant...i can't > seem to understand what CC (or whoever wrote the lyric) meant or want to > imply on the chorus especially on the line "i'll cut you in on 20 percent of > my future sin"...should i take the lyrics literally or does it have a more > "symbolical" meaning?. > > could someone help me on my question? > > > > Never_Named > > > ------------------------------ From: Cornell Subject: Re: oh yeah... Okay, okay, I spent a lot of time with this song...so shoot me. He spend all his money on a future grave means that he wasted his life sinning, and is now looking to have his sins forgiven. However, he thinks it may be too late and is spending all of the (wrong) resources (aka money power as opposed to faith and belief) to get salvation. Hence the question "Can I be saved?" Gregg On Thu, 26 Sep 1996 Dicknail@aol.com wrote: > > --------------------- > Forwarded message: > Subj: oh yeah... > Date: 96-09-26 20:05:13 EDT > From: Dicknail > To: soms@mit.edu > > oh and i forgot to mention the line [from wooden jesus] "can i be saved? i > spent all my money on a future grave..." this line always grabbed me cos it > sounded as if he meant that he had spent all his life preparing to have a > good afterlife but in the process had bought his way thru it... like he dint > know if he would "be saved" because of the way hed gone about ensuring his > very salvation. that made no sense...i can only hope that somene more > eloquent than me can translate it =) > > ~Piss Shivers~ > > "like wedding cake rotting in the graveyard > drowning dreams like poppies in the sea..." > -Bif Naked [ignorant americans...*grumblegrumble* heheh you know i dint mean > it right???!!! hee hee] > ------------------------------ Subject: Re: DOTUS is GREAT From: seth > LEAST FAVORITE= New Damage, or Fresh Deadly Roses Since I'm posting up a storm these days... Have you listened to the version of "New Damage" that's on the Alternative NRG compilation? It might change your mind... It is *heavy*. nothingseth ------------------------------ From: Cornell Subject: DoTU bashing Dammit!!! I love Down on the Upside, and no one can tell me different! YOu all know you wind up singing SG songs to yourself during the day, and that lots of 'em are from DoTU. HEHEHE!!! Gregg - -- "Fall into single file line" -- S. Weiland HEAVY ROTATION-"Rubberneck" toadies "Pretty Hate Machine" nine inch nails ______________________________________________________ | | | O V E R S O U L | |______________________________________________________| D E M O -- due to be completed mid-October ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Dotu vs. SU vs... From: seth > Extremely interesting thread we got going here. Let me enter this and > spew out some of my thoughts. Seth, I have to say..it does take a certain > amount of..I dunno..balls to say what you said about DOTU considering > your position. I didn't know I had a "position." I think I agree with what Caryn said; I'm just a Soundgarden fan, and I don't think my other responsibilities with the list and the Web page should affect my judgement. The reason I never really mentioned my feelings for DOTU in the past is what I cited in one of my earlier messages: it's tough to "face" 600_ Soundgarden fans and tell them you don't love anything and everything the band has ever done. > So Seth, would you catagorize yourself as > being "disappointed" with DOTU? What do you think about the future of SG? I'm not disappointed with it at all. If it makes some people happy, then it's a good album. It doesn't please me, and of course I would rather Soundgarden have put out a record filled with tracks that I love, but that's not a big deal to me. As someone pointed out yesterday or the day before, that's the beauty of recorded music: I can listen to Badmotorfinger until my ears bleed and never give DOTU another though if I so desire. And if Soundgarden continues to put out records that sound like DOTU, I won't necessarily like them (or dislike them, for that matter), but it won't stop me from being a fan, because their back catalog won't just disappear... seth ------------------------------ From: dbradsh@unity.ncsu.edu Subject: Re: AM I MENTAL? nevermore--led zepplin... ******************************************************************************** Dee Dee Bradshaw-Autry "Be careful with me...I am fragile. Im a bitch babe...and Im on fire" Garbage http://www.infochase.com/ent/deedee/index.html "The shortest distance between two points may be a straight line, but the longest distance between them is `life'." SubG "Sleep tight for me...I'm gone..." Sound Garden ******************************************************************************** ------------------------------ From: oponfam@cnsnet.com Subject: More on Seth's tirade and various replies Seth wrote: > I mean, can you put on "Slaves & Bulldozers" or "Room A Thousand Years > Wide" or "Beyond The Wheel" or "Flower" or "Toy Box" or "Gun" or "4th > of July" or "Holy Water" or "Searching With My Good Eye Closed" or > "Like Suicide" and then put on "No Attention" or "Never Named" or > "Dusty" or "An Unkind" or "Rhinosaur" or "Pretty Noose" and not want > to cry? Actually Dusty is one of my favorite SG songs of all time. I have never so vehemently hated an entire body of work of a band I truly loved. And your hatred of DOTU is confusing to me since to me DOTU does have the feel and energy of early SG. In my opinion the one album that is the biggest departure from traditional Soundgarden is SuperUnknown, which is my least favorite SG album. When DOTU was released I held my breath because I didn't know what I would do if it continued along the lines of SU (I should know better, because every one of their albums is very unique). And I am so happy that I love DOTU, because it is very unlikely that SG is going to move backward in their future recordings. It also makes me sad that people could hate something that must be very personal to the band, especially since DOTU was produced by them. Any time an introspective band like Soundgarden puts out an album they bare their souls and I tend to stick by them (blind loyalty I guess) no matter what. I may not like everything they do, but I respect the band and each individual in it. I loved what Caryn had to say: > i am most definitely not one of the DotU haters. in fact, i think that > this album will stand out later on when we look back at the history of > soundgarden as one of their finest, of the moment where the band truly set > out on the road to their own identity. remember, they produced this > record themselves -- this was truly their first opportunity to do whatever > they wanted, without the watchful eye of a producer. yes, some of the > songs are probably experiments, or 'lets see if we can pull THIS off', but > so what? this is what they have to say to us at the moment. My sentiments exactly. I've considered DOTU a masterpiece since the first time I heard it. And Blind Dog, I don't think BMF was the pinnacle at all, although it may be seen as the "Glory Days". And some fans may never like anything as much as they like BMF, but that's personal opinions, not necessarily reality. Personally I don't think SG has been allowed to reach that pinnacle, whether through their own fault or that of others. They are certainly not "media darlings" and I think in many ways they have been held back creatively, which may be why they chose to produce themselves. If they continue to become more and more independent I think we'll see some amazing stuff. I LOVE what I'm seeing as Soundgarden grows. Its just sad that so many of you disagree (as I put up my flame shields) :) Kathie ------------------------------ From: Geoff Kleemola Subject: Re: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity I didn't have an oppurtunity to follow the list too closely over the summer, so I don't know how thoroughly this has been discussed, how many people did get shirts?? I know that I for one DIDN'T get one, even though I payed for one. Is there an official count?? It's kinda strange that only a few people got shirts. He probably started spending the money on rare Soundgarden cd's, boots, videos, lp's and shirts. Anyway, if there isn't an official count, I'll count. Send me email with tshirt in the subject, or just reply to this message. Geoff ------------------------------ From: infinite Subject: seth's challenge ok... let's look at "no wrong, no right", 3rd verse (i think it would = be) .... lyrics.=20 now look at something like "zero chance" which has really good lyrics = for anybody (not just sg) maybe if you guys aren't following, what i'm trying to get at is the = songwriting (no way, really??!?) pick a song off of previous sg albums.. = (SU aside, it is too closely related to DOTU) then compare it to the = newer ones. the songs are planned out much more (for the most part, = there are songs on previous albums that are arranged really well).. the = lyrics have an almost abstract amount of depth and emotion.. i think = chris really gained alot of ground through temple of the dog, which i = think is some of his best work. it really is just up to the listener i = guess. maybe some of us just get more off of the newer stuff then the = older. ??? infinite - who is more confused than when he started ps why am i doing this? because i have WAY too much time on me hands, end = i have no life ------------------------------ From: Geoff Kleemola Subject: Re: Knight of the soundtable They send out the welcome packages at the beginning of each month, so if you are going to join send now to receive in mid-october. Email the fanclub for pricing. It came out to over $20 Canadian for me to join. Geoff On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, Josh Garza wrote: > well this has probably been posted before, but would someone please inform me > of HOW long it takes to recieve anything and how much it cost... i'm wondering > if the money u were supposed to mail increased with me knowing or > something..!??!?! just wondering, thanx > > > oh yeh, anyone planning on getting backstage during one of the shows...? i've > seen that oppurtunity for the austin show flashed in my face, but very > unlikely.......owelll > > > -- > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > TeachNet, College of Education, University of Texas, Austin Texas > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > ------------------------------ Subject: Re: AM I MENTAL? From: jsimpson@mail03.mitre.org (Jamesetta Simpson) >1)WHAT IS THE NAME OF THE SONG Nevermore... > AND WHO IS/ARE THE ARTIST(S)? Led Zep >2)TO WHAT ARE THESE LYRICS REFERRING TO? Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit. Plant and Page were very big fans of J.R.R. Tolkien works. Myself I have read them both 3 times and I have a collectors editions of both books. Also have The Silmarillion and Gilden-Fire written by Stephen R. Donaldson.. And to make this SG related. I have stated a few times in the past that the verses or topics of SG and the members of Led Zep differ, because of the reality factor. Led Zep loved magic, fantasy, where SG writes in verse about today's world. Both bands (Plant/Cornnel mostly) have a similar writing style, but their subject matter go to different ends of the spectrum.. Jamie (Village Idiot) ------------------------------ From: Geoff Kleemola Subject: Re: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity Oh yeah, I'll count "did-NOT-gets" too. Just reply to this message if you did or did not get a shirt. You could also give a rating between 1 and 10 if you got one. So far I've got two bad ratings. Geoff > > At 05:53 PM 9/26/96 -0500, I wrote: > >I didn't have an oppurtunity to follow the list too closely over the > >summer, so I don't know how thoroughly this has been discussed, how many > >people did get shirts?? I know that I for one DIDN'T get one, even > >though I payed for one. Is there an official count?? It's kinda strange > >that only a few people got shirts. He probably started spending the > >money on rare Soundgarden cd's, boots, videos, lp's and shirts. Anyway, > >if there isn't an official count, I'll count. Send me email with tshirt > >in the subject, or just reply to this message. > >Geoff > > > > ------------------------------ From: alexander ebora Subject: like,love sommsters, lend me your eyes... although this is getting too old...i would like to tell everyone on the list that i really like several songs on DOTUS...among these are Never Named (but the chorus needs a bit of work), Ty Cobb, BIMH (but the airplay is slowly killing my fondness for this song), An Unkind and No Attention...when I first read that some of you sommsters don't like some of these songs, i felt shocked but when i read that you like some of the songs i don't normally spend time listening, i felt that it's just the "different strokes for different strokes" thing again...and with this i realized that you can't judge someone accurately by the songs he/she likes/dislikes...each and everyone of us get different reactions to different kinds of stimuli...but the most important of all is that we make Soundgarden one of our major source of stimuli. i hope i contributed something important this time. Never_Named ------------------------------ From: Ross Filipek Subject: Re: AM I MENTAL? "Ramble On" by Led Zeppelin. It's in reference to the character Gollum (who found the One Ring) in J. R. R. Tolkien's _The Hobbit_ from the _Lord of the Rings_ series. But why does Robert Plant (the one with the feather rune) play drums on the Goodyear Blimp? Ross - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Tue, 26 Sep 1995, Misty Shaw wrote: > TWO QUESTIONS: 1)WHAT IS THE NAME OF THE SONG AND WHO IS/ARE THE ARTIST(S)? > 2)TO WHAT ARE THESE LYRICS REFERRING TO? > Hint: The one with the feather-rune plays drums on the Goodyear blimp. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "It's 106 miles to Chicago. We've got a full tank of gas, half a packet of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses. Hit it." --Joliet Jake and Elwood Blues ------------------------------ From: Josh_Garza@teachnet.edb.utexas.edu (Josh Garza) Subject: Knight of the soundtable well this has probably been posted before, but would someone please inform me of HOW long it takes to recieve anything and how much it cost... i'm wondering if the money u were supposed to mail increased with me knowing or something..!??!?! just wondering, thanx oh yeh, anyone planning on getting backstage during one of the shows...? i've seen that oppurtunity for the austin show flashed in my face, but very unlikely.......owelll - -- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- TeachNet, College of Education, University of Texas, Austin Texas - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ From: alexander ebora Subject: wooden jesus i was pondering on what the lyrics of wooden jesus by TOTD meant...i can't seem to understand what CC (or whoever wrote the lyric) meant or want to imply on the chorus especially on the line "i'll cut you in on 20 percent of my future sin"...should i take the lyrics literally or does it have a more "symbolical" meaning?. could someone help me on my question? Never_Named ------------------------------ From: Dicknail@aol.com Subject: Re: wooden jesus In a message dated 96-09-26 19:50:53 EDT, you write: >i was pondering on what the lyrics of wooden jesus by TOTD meant...i can't >seem to understand what CC (or whoever wrote the lyric) meant or want to >imply on the chorus especially on the line "i'll cut you in on 20 percent of >my future sin"...should i take the lyrics literally or does it have a more >"symbolical" meaning?. > >could someone help me on my question? "wooden jesus ill cut you in on twenty percent of my future sin" ok... i think its as if hes saying he knows hell make mistakes in the future so why not admit it? its also like one giant reminder of how nearly everything in the world right now is based on money, success and gaining success by having lo9ts of money... to me it sounds like hes implying that maybe jesus takes bribes..just my opinion, prolly not even close but thats what i got out of it. its all about how money and shit that shouldnt mean very much has become everything to everyone..."coat hanger halos dont come cheap, from television shepherds and living room sheep..." ~a not terribly religious DykeNail~ ------------------------------ From: Dicknail@aol.com Subject: oh yeah... - --------------------- Forwarded message: Subj: oh yeah... Date: 96-09-26 20:05:13 EDT From: Dicknail To: soms@mit.edu oh and i forgot to mention the line [from wooden jesus] "can i be saved? i spent all my money on a future grave..." this line always grabbed me cos it sounded as if he meant that he had spent all his life preparing to have a good afterlife but in the process had bought his way thru it... like he dint know if he would "be saved" because of the way hed gone about ensuring his very salvation. that made no sense...i can only hope that somene more eloquent than me can translate it =) ~Piss Shivers~ "like wedding cake rotting in the graveyard drowning dreams like poppies in the sea..." - -Bif Naked [ignorant americans...*grumblegrumble* heheh you know i dint mean it right???!!! hee hee] ------------------------------ From: Greg Bensimon Subject: Re: wooden jesus At 07:47 PM 9/26/96 -0400, alexander ebora wrote: > >i was pondering on what the lyrics of wooden jesus by TOTD meant...i can't >seem to understand what CC (or whoever wrote the lyric) meant or want to >imply on the chorus especially on the line "i'll cut you in on 20 percent of >my future sin"...should i take the lyrics literally or does it have a more >"symbolical" meaning?. >could someone help me on my question? > > > >Never_Named My take on Wooden Jesus is that it expresses CC's distaste with the commercialization of religeon. Think of the PTL Club, the scandals surrounding Jim Bakker and Jimmy Swaggart, and you get the idea. Wooden Jesus, were are you from? Korea or Canada or maybe Taiwan. Obviously mass produced renderings of Jesus. I didn't know it was the Holy Land. But I believed from the minute the check left my hand, and I pray. Can I be saved? I spent all my money on a future grave. Wooden Jesus I'll cut you in on twenty percent of my future sin. So this person mailed his donation to the PTL Club or 700 Club or whatever. He received a "Wooden Jesus" as a thank you. So now he's wondering, "I've shown my support for my faith. I've made my investment in God. Have I ensured my place in Heaven?" The next verse is just a damning... Porcelain Mary, her majesties pure, looking for virgin territory. Coat hanger halos don't come cheap from television shepherds with living room sheep... So here's Jim, or Tammy Fay, or Jimmie out on the prowl. Passing him (or her) self off as only concerned with God and His Kingdom, looking for more desperate souls to bilk. Sitting there on TV, on some cozy "living room" set. With no real purpose, except to sell "coat hanger halos" to an audience that's either too naive or too scared to question the guy on TV's real purpose. Well, that's my interpretation. Anyone else? Greg ------------------------------ From: Greg Bensimon Subject: More SG Covers I just finished listening to Led Zeppelin II again and I was thinking. It would be really cool to hear SG cover Whole Lotta Love. It just seems to me like a piece that would suit SG really well, considering the vocals and odd guitar sounds. Probably won't end up as part of their set during the tour, but it would be really cool... Greg ------------------------------ From: "Dan \"Pop-tart\" Hearsch" Subject: Re: wooden jesus On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, alexander ebora wrote: > > i was pondering on what the lyrics of wooden jesus by TOTD meant...i can't > seem to understand what CC (or whoever wrote the lyric) meant or want to > imply on the chorus especially on the line "i'll cut you in on 20 percent of > my future sin"...should i take the lyrics literally or does it have a more > "symbolical" meaning?. > > could someone help me on my question? > > > > Never_Named > > > > i'm thinking it's a rip on televangelists. i see it as him singing about the way televangelists use their flocks. the chorus is kind of his exasperation about having sent in money (not chris himself literally, but his song persona) and getting nothing in return. so in exchange for the money, he'll also give 20% of all the consepquences of his future sin. that kind of thing anyway, he doesn't seem to like televangelists ------------------------------ From: "DashosheE" Subject: Re: seth's challenge I know that although I don't know all that much about the previous SG (before BMF) i would have to say that songs such as TDITTL and Overfloater have some pretty powerful lyrics. They make you think, but remember, I can't say that they are better than anything predating BMF. ______________ Come on in and take me on an override ______________ dashoshe@neca.com http://www.neca.com/~dashoshe - ---------- From: infinite To: 'somms@mit.edu' Subject: seth's challenge Date: Thursday, September 26, 1996 7:09 PM ok... let's look at "no wrong, no right", 3rd verse (i think it would be) ... lyrics. now look at something like "zero chance" which has really good lyrics for anybody (not just sg) maybe if you guys aren't following, what i'm trying to get at is the songwriting (no way, really??!?) pick a song off of previous sg albums.. (SU aside, it is too closely related to DOTU) then compare it to the newer ones. the songs are planned out much more (for the most part, there are songs on previous albums that are arranged really well).. the lyrics have an almost abstract amount of depth and emotion.. i think chris really gained alot of ground through temple of the dog, which i think is some of his best work. it really is just up to the listener i guess. maybe some of us just get more off of the newer stuff then the older. ??? infinite - who is more confused than when he started ps why am i doing this? because i have WAY too much time on me hands, end i have no life - ---------- ------------------------------ From: "Burris, Benjamin CDT " Subject: RE: hated songs ON DOTU, I don't like "Ty Cobb", its too stupid. Soundgarden kicks ass and is my favorite band but Ty Cobb just sucks. My favorite song on DOTU is Tighter and Tighter. I guess I like the slow songs by Soundgarden that get heavy at certain points. I kind of Contradict myself because my 2nd favorite soundgarden song is Jesus Christ Pose, and it is very fast. I would have to say that the best ever SG song is "Outshined". "Show me the power child" Cadet B. J. Burris West Point >---------- >From: jsk@tiac.net[SMTP:jsk@tiac.net] >Sent: Thursday, September 26, 1996 10:06 PM >To: somms@MIT.EDU >Subject: hated songs > >>is it possible for a list member to not like or even hate a recorded >>soundgarden song. > >Of course it's possible to hate Soundgarden songs. Almost every band I like >has some losers as far as i'm concerned...it's the good song/bad song ratio >that makes a band good or bad, imho. SG has few, admittedly, which is why >I'm a list member. > >There are some bands whose songs I like across the board, whose CDs I play >straight through. But actually, these bands often have songs that sound >very much alike (like Lungfish or Screeching Weasel or others I can't think >of right now) so it's harder for them to miss, once I've already accepted >their 'sound' as something I like. >Soundgarden, on the other hand, has tried a bunch of different things. This >makes them more likely to have a few songs that don't quite work...and this >is not a bad thing, so don't send me obnoxious flames about it. > >That said, the only song that pops to mind immediately is "Blow Up The >Outside World." It's so overproduced. I hate it because of Chris' muffled, >nasally vocals, and because the melody and lyrics are painfully dull.It >sounds like an attempt at a Sgt. Pepper's medley that doesn't quite fly. >I'm sorry if it was an intentional tribute, I don't like it anyway. > >Now see, if it were some other band, I probably WOULDN'T hate it. I would >think it was okay. But how can I stand such mediocrity from one of the best >bands ever? > > > >OK, so, anyone else hate a song? (and don't forget your diatribe, he DID >ask us to explain our hatred). > >That was fun. I'm going to go listen to the rest of DOTU now. > >----- >Jezebel > >p.s. I'll probably be so carried away by the time I finally get to see them >live that I'll cheer for BUTOW anyway. > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ From: "Luck's Last Match" Subject: Matt, albums, stuff... Matt has to be the best drummer i've ever seen live...all over the damn set--sometimes in the same beat....Of course i know little or nothing about bonham...and i haven't gotten into rush yet....so he doesn't have the greatest competition, but i still think he completely rocks...i want to learn drums and matt is going to be my role model...of course, first i have to buy a drum set....no tengo dinero....old well... And as far as albums go, i like DOTU, but i'm not sure what SG album i like best. They all have different feels...and i always think to myself "What do i want to hear?" and the answer is never "SG" it's always a particular song or album...like last night i had to hear umok for smokestack lightning, because i wanted to play it on guitar and i couldn't remember the line...but then when btw came on the volume on my radio immediately rose to maximum proportions. But i digress. What i like about DOTU is that it seems fresh..Dusty especially has a guitar line that is relaxing and upbeat without falling into soft rock status. Applebite has to be the most ambient SG song...Yes, all sg's albums are diverse, but DOTU is probly the most diverse, at least to my ears. Applebite vs. No Attention, i.e. And the album does seem to be produced well to me, despite certain dirty sounding songs (pretty noose) Those songs feel right when they have the dirty sound. But then again i like umok particularly for the reason that it is very noisy and not well produced. BMF has to be the Ultimate SG album, but i can't call it my favorite. Louder Than Love has songs i actually skip (Full on Kev's Mom; I awake) so that is disqualified. Superunknown is an awesome album, but it's just missing something from SG, i'm not sure what. I'd have to say it's a tie between BMF, UMOK, and DOTU. And i'm 19, if that helps anyone. Have to go now, my friend is kicking me out of her room....old well...laters. -j "Stand up and everyone will see your holiness" -Soundgarden. ------------------------------ From: jsk@tiac.net Subject: hated songs >is it possible for a list member to not like or even hate a recorded >soundgarden song. Of course it's possible to hate Soundgarden songs. Almost every band I like has some losers as far as i'm concerned...it's the good song/bad song ratio that makes a band good or bad, imho. SG has few, admittedly, which is why I'm a list member. There are some bands whose songs I like across the board, whose CDs I play straight through. But actually, these bands often have songs that sound very much alike (like Lungfish or Screeching Weasel or others I can't think of right now) so it's harder for them to miss, once I've already accepted their 'sound' as something I like. Soundgarden, on the other hand, has tried a bunch of different things. This makes them more likely to have a few songs that don't quite work...and this is not a bad thing, so don't send me obnoxious flames about it. That said, the only song that pops to mind immediately is "Blow Up The Outside World." It's so overproduced. I hate it because of Chris' muffled, nasally vocals, and because the melody and lyrics are painfully dull.It sounds like an attempt at a Sgt. Pepper's medley that doesn't quite fly. I'm sorry if it was an intentional tribute, I don't like it anyway. Now see, if it were some other band, I probably WOULDN'T hate it. I would think it was okay. But how can I stand such mediocrity from one of the best bands ever? OK, so, anyone else hate a song? (and don't forget your diatribe, he DID ask us to explain our hatred). That was fun. I'm going to go listen to the rest of DOTU now. - ----- Jezebel p.s. I'll probably be so carried away by the time I finally get to see them live that I'll cheer for BUTOW anyway. ------------------------------ From: Geoff Kleemola Subject: Re: DOTUS is GREAT Hey I think we should watch out for this mysterious guy, who's suddenly posting all these messages. I think he might be trying to infiltrate the list and get us to send him tshirt money... On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, seth wrote: > > Since I'm posting up a storm these days... > > Have you listened to the version of "New Damage" that's on the > Alternative NRG compilation? It might change your mind... > > It is *heavy*. > > nothingseth > ------------------------------ From: spierce@mpls.k12.mn.us (Sandy Pierce) Subject: those who favor DOTU i think some people probably feel towards down on the upside the way seth describes how he feels for badmotorfinger. i love badmotorfinger to death. the album simply rocks my world. but some songs on dotu move me in a way no other soundgarden songs ever have. for me, songs like boot camp make me quiver. that one (for example) have a sad, longing, lonely feeling to them that i really like. but that's just my own personal tastes. i hope this adds a little flava to the discussion. to put it this way- i like badmotorfinger as a whole album. i like dotu as a few really good songs, and them some other songs. but they both get about the some airplay in my stereo. i listen to those two records more than my other soundgarden ones. o.k. that's it. amanda "what do blind dogs believe? i don't want to know..." ------------------------------ From: blind dog Subject: looking for a pedestal... On Wed, 25 Sep 1996, seth wrote: > I can do is stand there and shake my head in awe. Nothing on DOTU has > that effect on me. The songs are not *bad*, don't get me wrong, but > there's just something lacking. now that the thread is catching fire in a big way, I think I'll throw in another couple of my thoughts. I think the term I would use (carefully) for down on the upside would be "easy-listening". that is, the easy-listening version of soundgarden. imho dotu represents a band that has, despite the obvious enthusiasm of ty cobb's chorus, mellowed out, and a band that has changed irrevocably from the one we knew on badmotorfinger. when I first heard dotu (on a pre-release), it sounded like the best work soundgarden had ever produced. everything was there: the crashing guitars, the big drums and the wailing vocals. the songs sounded great, and there was nothing glaringly wrong with the production. but the passing of close to four months has taken the gloss off the record for me. don't get me wrong, dotu is still a good album in its own right. but even while I like listening to some of the songs, most of the record sounds (sadly) like a somewhat watered-down version of soundgarden of old. besides the obvious musical skills of all four members of the band, I think the greatest strength of soundgarden's music is their ability to communicate emotion with their listeners. I'm sure that this is why so many listers love songs like mailman, beyond the wheel and hands all over; the band's ability to write music and lyrics that convey a real *meaning* to the audience makes the music special. the music on badmotorfinger and superunknown (and louder than love, to a degree) does this as better than just about any band I have ever heard. but dotu just does not seem to have that magic spark which makes an album - particularly a soundgarden album - special to me. only songs such as pretty noose, butow and boot camp seem to hold the same emotion that soundgarden songs once did. furthermore, the band has said a number of times (as we all know) that the production processes of earlier albums were not conducive to producing an emotive and "heartfelt" record; one that truly captures the essence of the band. on the strength of dotu, I would disagree. the added emphasis on self-production and 'experimentation' has not lent a more "real" sound to the band at all. I would argue that playing the same riff for three days in a row did not hurt superunknown's "real-ness". I for one would certainly take the curdling soul of limo wreck far faster than I would cling to the rawness of no attention. but of course, it is not only the sound of an album which makes it great. there must be good songs. and while the band may ultimately be happy with what they have written for dotu, I personally don't think that this group of sixteen songs is a patch on bmf's twelve or superunk's sixteen. pretty noose is a good song. so is butow, tighter, overfloater and burden. but after that group, the quality seems to thin out a little. very few of the songs hold that special ingredient that made so many of their earlier songs wonderful to me. I think in some ways the album is akin to louder than love. plenty of above average songs, but no focus and no magic to hold it all together, and very few songs which rise above just being good soundgarden songs. in the end, down on the upside represents (once again imo) an almost dilluted form of soundgarden and their music, an album searching for direction but unable to find it. ----------------------------------- a thousand doors, a thousand lies rooms a thousand years wide - words by kim thayil ----------------------------------- ------------------------------ From: Ross Filipek Subject: Re: looking for a pedestal... Right on, Blind Dog. _BMF_ has a dark, encompassing quality that I don't hear on _DOTU_. That's not to say the latest album is bad, rather it's "easy-listening" in comparison to the earlier stuff. Ross - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Fri, 27 Sep 1996, blind dog wrote: > now that the thread is catching fire in a big way, I think I'll > throw in another couple of my thoughts. I think the term I would use > (carefully) for down on the upside would be "easy-listening". that is, > the easy-listening version of soundgarden. imho dotu represents a band > that has, despite the obvious enthusiasm of ty cobb's chorus, mellowed > out, and a band that has changed irrevocably from the one we knew on > badmotorfinger. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "It's 106 miles to Chicago. We've got a full tank of gas, half a packet of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses. Hit it." --Joliet Jake and Elwood Blues ------------------------------ From: Aleko Subject: Re: like dying soldiers... Blind Dog asked if Soundgarden could twelve songs as good as Badmotorfinger. Well they have done better then that. They have written 16 songs as good on Superunknown, which is why i prefer that album to all the others. Infact it is my equal favourite album of all time along with ...And Justice for All (have i mentioned that this album is brilliant). I really like DoTU as well. Their last three albums are easily their best IMHO All this means is the next album will be great and that if they continue on this path they become one of the greatest bands, if not the greatest ever. I don't dislike the earlier albums (LTL, UOK) they were needed for Soundgarden's natural progression. I am suprised at myself for liking Superunknown more than Badmotorfiner since i am more of a metal fan, and Badmotorfinger is definitely a metal album. It annoys when they say they don't like being called metal. Metal got a bad rap because of a few bad hair bands in the eighties. Metalheads are fooled by the media telling them that Soundgarden and all these new bands are 'Alternate' or 'grunge' and that they shouldn't like them. People are fooled by the media into believing that metal is played by brain dead idiots, it has stupid lyrics, and can only be either thrash, or death. Metallica, Soundgarden, Alice in Chains, Sepultura, Faith no More, Tool are all metal. They are not exactly the same style of music but if they had to be that would be the same as saying that Vanilia Ice and Public Enemy are both rap so they must be very similar. PS All of this post is IMHO. BTW Soundgarden and Metallica are great but Rap can be too e.g. Public Enemy. "Rock n' roll doesn't have a soul, just a dick and a wallet" --- Kim Thayil ------------------------------ From: The Guitarist-2001 Subject: Re: wooden jesus At 11:47 PM 9/26/96 +0000, Never_Named wrote: > >i was pondering on what the lyrics of wooden jesus by TOTD meant...i can't >seem to understand what CC (or whoever wrote the lyric) meant or want to >imply on the chorus especially on the line "i'll cut you in on 20 percent of >my future sin"...should i take the lyrics literally or does it have a more >"symbolical" meaning?. > >could someone help me on my question? Well, I think all of the proposed explanations so far are quite valid, especially the one about knowing you're going to sin so why not admit it (Dicknail?), and the one about sending in money to a religious organization to secure a place in heaven (can't remember who, sorry) . . . . . . I ALSO think myself of a reference simply to the whole Christian belief that by dying on the cross (wooden cross), Jesus accepted the punishment for all of our sins, so CC might be saying about how Jesus suffered for all of our sins, past/present/FUTURE . . . but knowing CC, I doubt this was it . . . oh well . . . The Guitarist-2001 "The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist" - The Usual Suspects Check out CORE - The Ultimate Site For Teens: http://members.aol.com/dczoner/index.html - Soundgarden=band of the month! (...any suggestions for a guitar page?) ------------------------------ From: Aleko Subject: Re: old, new fav On Wed, 25 Sep 1996, seth wrote: > > One of the reasons I ask this is because in order for me to enjoy > music, it has to do something to me, it has to move me in some way. If > it moves the band and they're thrilled with it, that's all fine and > good, but it doesn't mean it affects me in the least and therefore > doesn't mean I haev to enjoy it. > Well DOTU has some very moving moments for me. How about Blow up the outside world. They way the song builds up. Very mellow and laid back it holds back before it hits you with the incredible chorus. Burden in My Hand is also great. It doesn't sound intense but it also builds up and takes a long time to grow on you. Applebite a very different song even for Soundgarden. Tighter & Tighter like a blues song on steroids, vocals and guitars hit a peak at the end which is hard to match in any Soundgarden song. IMHO much more powerful then Beyond the Wheel (as much as i like this song). Overfloater and NEver the Machine Forever, two great songs but very different. Overfloater also has a great guitar solo as does much of DOTU, the solos are easily better then those on Badmotorfinger. The lyrics on the album are as good as ever, the vocals are much more varied then ever before. I love the way Chris sings BIMH and NTMF, very different but fitting the songs perfectly. The band has learnt to hold back and in doing so have made the powerful bits even more powerful. Badmotorfinger is varied no doubt, but the last two albums are even more so. As long as the band can play the different styles well and writes good songs, variety only enhances an album. > The songs on Badmotorfinger have this incredible, powerful quality > about them that just blows me away every time I listen to them. > They're on a level above "rock songs." When I hear the intro to "Room > A Thousand Years Wide" or "Searching With My Good Eye Closed" or > "Jesus Christ Pose" I'm absolutely *glued* to the speakers. I can't > shift my focus to anything else while the music is playing. About all > I can do is stand there and shake my head in awe. Badmotorfinger is awesome but i think not all on the songs are great: Face Pollution, Somewhere, Searching with my Good Eye Closed, Mind Riot are excellent songs but there is heaps of stuff on Superunkown and on DOTU easily better then them. Nothing on DOTU has > that effect on me. The songs are not *bad*, don't get me wrong, but > there's just something lacking. In your opinion. I don't see anything lacking. > > > Each time a new Soundgarden record comes out, someone says "Wow, this > is their most diverse collection of songs to date." (Actually, since I > only got into the band in 1992, I can only say this about the last 3 > records, but whatever) And then when the next album comes out, the > previous album is suddenly considered a collection of 12 or 15 of the > same songs. Even thought what you say is true DOTU IS the most diverse collection of songs to date. I don't see how you can argue with that fact. You don't have to like this or prefer the album to Badmotorfinger. Infact i don't. But i still find many songs on DOTU incredibly moving. Granted, each album has a certain "sound" to it, but I > would argue much of this is due to production. I don't see this. Soudngarden have said that a producer is just a sound engineer for them. They could have said, 'we prefer this song to sound like this'. Superunknown has one producer (besides Soundgarden) and its songs are different sounding all the way throught the album. Badmotorfinger is an > incredibly diverse collection of songs: compare "Jesus Christ Pose" to > "New Damage," for example. I don't see how I could get tired of 2 more > records filled with music like this... But Soundgarden could get tired of this and as a result write lesser songs. Would you prefer this? > > seth > > "Rock n' roll doesn't have a soul, just a dick and a wallet" --- Kim Thayil ------------------------------ From: Carolyn Hanel Subject: RE: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity - PLEASE LET ME KNOW ABOUT OLD SHIRTS Firstly, Dena, many thanks to you for being willing to take on this = enormous task. I've already written to you about that. I'm mainly writing to let people know that I still haven't received a = shirt from Nothingman. I know some of the somms listers have - but have = any Australians received theirs?????? I'm interested to know this. = Could EVERYONE who HAS received a shirt from Nothingman please email ME = (personally - not on the list) so I can do a tally of who has received = the goods? I have all the original lists here of who ordered them and = what sizes - I'm keen to check off against that. This is starting to annoy me now (yeah, takes a while to rile me up) - = we in Australia had to pay, as well as the shirt money, the extra = postage/shipping money, AND another $6 just to get a US money order sent = out. Basically it cost me $26 (Australian). It's probably a similar = story for others who sent money in from outside the States.=20 :-O NOTHINGMAN, THE LEAST YOU CAN DO IS SEND OUT SHIRTS TO THOSE = WHO HAD TO PAY THE MOST MONEY!!!!!! I'm also rather pissed off about = the fact that it was ME who gathered all the names from everyone, and = what size shirts they wanted - Nothingman didn't do that part - and it = was a very time-consuming, tedious task that seems to have been all for = nothing! Why can't I at least get a shirt?? :-[ = AAAAAAUUUGGHHH!!!!!!!!!! Phew. Now I have that off my chest I feel much better. :-) Dena, once again, thanks. Even though I've been once bitten, I'm NOT = going to be twice shy with you. GOOD LUCK!!! Carolyn the Marooned and Far-away Push, push, push till we get some motion.....Soundgarden ------------------------------ From: Carolyn Hanel Subject: RE: IMPORTANT: New SOMMS t-shirt opportunity Geoff Kleemola wrote: >>I didn't have an oppurtunity to follow the list too closely over the=20 summer, so I don't know how thoroughly this has been discussed, how many = people did get shirts?? I know that I for one DIDN'T get one, even=20 though I payed for one. Is there an official count?? It's kinda = strange=20 that only a few people got shirts. He probably started spending the=20 money on rare Soundgarden cd's, boots, videos, lp's and shirts. Anyway, = if there isn't an official count, I'll count. Send me email with tshirt = in the subject, or just reply to this message. Oops - seems great minds think alike, Geoff! I posted something similar = to the list earlier. =20 So I guess people can email either me or Geoff with "yes I got my shirt" = or "no I didn't get my shirt" and between us we can let the list know = the numbers. Carolyn the Most Forlorn Kick, kick, kick till the truth is spoken.......Soundgarden ------------------------------ End of somms Digest [Volume 2 Issue 256] ****************************************